| Author | Message | ||
     kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 80 Registered: 05-2005 |
Did anybody watch The British Comedy Awards, er I mean The Brits last night? For any Americans/Aussies etc who may not be aware this is the British version of the Grammys, or the MTV awards. I dont mean to be precious, but i got more and more depressed as the program went on. Major winners were The Kaiser Chiefs (poor mans XTC), Coldplay (surely the most overrated band of all time - Chris Martin has a face you would never tire of punching!) KT f'in Tunstall, some "urban" geezer called Lemar (Marvin and Otis must be turning in their graves!) and Madonna (who looked embarrased just to be there). However, the biggest tragedy of all was when the most talented man in the arena, Wayne Coyne, was reduced to giving some posh tit called James Blunt an award, cant remember what it was - services to blandness probably. I really fear for the next generation of music lovers - they are being force fed this pap and are falling for it hook line and sinker. Time for another rebellion a la 1976 I hope. Sorry to be so negative but after I came out of my depression I got really angry , and believe me I have calmed down a lot since last night!! | ||
| abigail law Member Username: Abigail Post Number: 33 Registered: 06-2005 |
unfortunately i did watch most it. the only redeeming feature being the god-like return of prince with wendy&lisa and sheila e on drums worth wasting 2 and a half hours of my life for - they put coldplay, kaiser chiefs et al to shame | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 138 Registered: 08-2004 |
I can't see the problem here. I didn't watch it, but it isn't indicative of the quality of new music in this or any country, it never has. BTW what did Prince play. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 85 Registered: 05-2005 |
you're missing the point jerry. the major record companies sponser these events to ensure that the airwaves and music stores are awash with this crud, at the expense of young up and coming left field talent. they must love guys like you  | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 139 Registered: 08-2004 |
Come on it's only the idiots/masses they are fooling. I know how & why these awards work. It is outrageous how sales are doubled by a nomination when they sounded exactly the same before. People who don't really like music need somebody to decide what they listen to, the big record co.'s exploit them. But aren't they just there for the taking? I feel innovative music is not pushed back any further now than it was 20 years ago. That was my point. If a rebellion is what you seek, then maybe it's up to you to provide it. I can just listen to what I like, old or new. There are a lot more outlets available to bands now, myspace & other sites such as tagworld are affecting record sales too. As well as the weekly & monthly music press & digital radio. There is an audience for the leftfield stuff & there always will be, just don't wait for the corporations to tell you. Enjoy what you listen to & there's no need to get worked up, if you're not prepared to do anything about it. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 86 Registered: 05-2005 |
you're missing the point jerry. the major record companies sponser these events to ensure that the airwaves and music stores are awash with this crud, at the expense of young up and coming left field talent. they must love guys like you | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 87 Registered: 05-2005 |
walk into a record shop just now and you wont be able to move for brits nominated crap. guess what wont be in the racks to make way for this pap. why do you think they hold this award in february and not summertime when they have new product to shift? wise up jerry | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 158 Registered: 03-2005 |
People still actually go into record shops? Out here in LA, record stores are closing fast. One of our venerable independents from whom I bought so many things as experiments back in the 80s is currently shutting down. The big corporate flagship Tower Records on the Sunset Strip seems to never have more than a half dozen shoppers in the whole store. People are either downloading or buying from Amazon or, in the case of the major label stuff, buying from the big discounters like Walmart and Best Buy. Jerry has a point. The one and only truly successful record shop in town now is Amoeba, a huge independent focused upon providing the most enormous selection of new and used music. This store is always full of people. Nearly none of them are buying major label releases. The store's staff posts little explanatory cards over releases explaining why you might want to buy them. These are genuinely informative and have occasionally influenced my own choices. The major labels largely cater to folks for whom music is a commodity, something they sing along to or play casually in the background. For them it's like a new shirt or a new pair of shoes. They play it for a while, wear it out and then forget it for the next new pair of shoes. The role played by the majors is like an integral, it's constantly contracting without (yet) reaching zero. I've read a number of times that the majors would all be insolvent if it were not for their back catalogues from the days when they (or the companies they acquired) actually developed new talent. It is my impression that there is more wonderful music being released now than ever. Because nearly none of it has anything to do with the majors, the challenge is finding out about it. That's where the online resources Jerry mentions comes in. I count this bulletin board in this too; I've picked up many terrific tips from folks on here. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 81 Registered: 05-2005 |
One thing that has emerged over here in England, I suspect influenced by the US, is the sale of CD's DVD's etc etc, at supermarkets and all at very very low prices. All the stuff I like that gets distributed into the supermarlet chains I get at £5 0r £6 cheaper than most of the HMV, Virgin and Tower's. Don't like ordering online that much as I have to wait weeks, what's it like elsewhere? Back to the thread. Awards are always shite aren't they? Mind you, I suppose the commercial musical climate is much better now than in the late 80's or early 90's, so at least we don't have Phil Collins collecting 10 years in a row... | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 88 Registered: 05-2005 |
never thought i would ever utter these words spence, but as much as i loathe and despise phil collins and everything he has released, if you were to force me to listen to his stuff at gunpoint i would. as long as it was not that prat, twat and any other word that ends in at, james blunt that i had to listen to. music has plumbed new depths with this talentless berk - see what he's doing to me - i am even typing words that are never ever in my everyday vocabulary. at least with collins and his ilk you could imagine they got into music because they actually really wanted to do it. This Blunt freak is only in music because he wants to be a star - people like him are incapable of truly loving music. of course jerry has a point when he talks about the other ways of acquiring music these days, but how many people actually know about this. for most people i still think they buy music in a store, whether that be virgin, tescos or walmart - and that is where you are forcefed the dross | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 142 Registered: 08-2004 |
I don't think many people would buy something if it's got a bigger display in a shop. It's repetitive play on radio & the many music tv channels, that pushes major label acts on the public. That's what is truly vulgar about the corporate aspect of the lowest art form. At least they aren't able to make the same amount of profit now as they were in the first 15 years of the CD generation, per item. | ||
| Mark Leydon Member Username: Mark_leydon Post Number: 36 Registered: 05-2005 |
Paul Weller was asked in a recent interview with The Independent (UK daily) if he would like to jam with James Blunt at The Brit Awards. "I would rather eat my own shit", was his succinct reply. Speaking of The Brits, spotted the following in this week's PopBitch site: "Three facts about this year's awards yawnfest: 1. Goldman Sachs had more guests than MTV. 2. Kaiser Chiefs' performance of I Predict A Riot was the cue for waiting staff to serve guests with stilton and oatcakes. 3. James Blunt's performance coincided with the biggest queue of the night at the men's toilets." | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 151 Registered: 05-2005 |
Jerry, people are lazy. If they go into a record shop and see a large display of something 'nice' they heard on the radio or saw on MTV, they will buy it. They don't want to have to look for it. Only music geeks such as myself get enjoyment from going through racks and aisles of records and CDs. A friend who works for Waterstones told me the same principle applies there - whatever is the big display is what sells. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 160 Registered: 03-2005 |
People ARE lazy. And they get what they deserve. | ||
| Matt Ellis Member Username: Matt_ellis Post Number: 49 Registered: 11-2004 |
Good one Mark Laydon - I'm still laughing from the Stilton Oakcakes revelation!. I would be suprised if anyone who regularly reads this board would see the Brits as anything other than a corporate showcase - with the sole purpose of increasing marketing power and sales very quickly. Get the UK suits down to places like the Islington Academy on a wet Sunday night in front of 40 die hard fans to see a band who haven't toured for 6 years. Thats a true rock and roll event. | ||
| Peter Azzopardi Member Username: Pete Post Number: 137 Registered: 09-2004 |
Mothers listen to Coldplay and James Blunt. At least mine does. Jack Johnson and Missy Higgins too. It's a real mother's market out there. | ||
| Matt Ellis Member Username: Matt_ellis Post Number: 50 Registered: 11-2004 |
On the subject of Coldplay - did anyone see their VH-1 Storytellers Session? I saw it for the first time on Saturday here in the UK on Channel 4 (I don't have satellite)Does anyone else agree that the band (apart from Chris Martin) come across as extremely studios to the point of being po-faced? The interviewer asked a question around the chemistry between the band members.I thought it was hilarious when Chris Martin answered the question at great length after most of the band had chipped in with their thoughts. Martin rounded off by saying sarcastically "yes all these factors contribute to making us the thirty seventh best band ever"! | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 85 Registered: 05-2005 |
Great Paul Weller comment Mark, I wish there were more like him in this day and age, I love the man, nearly as original as MORRISSEY, not quite but nearly, still similar sized icon though (in my humble opinion). I loved them both as a young boy and a teenager, For those out there who will comment on this given generational differences etc The Jam influenced me greatly from the ages of 10 to 13, The Smiths from 14 to 16, and beyond of course, The GoBees I got into when I was 15 which was 22 years ago! | ||
| gareth w Member Username: Gareth Post Number: 30 Registered: 05-2005 |
Paul Weller is probably my most disliked man in music. A more smug, self important, ‘I play real music, me’ excuse for a musician I’ve yet to encounter. As if by plugging in a guitar, ripping off some old Who/Kinks numbers and going on stage suddenly makes you better or more authentic than a band who use sequencers and an Apple Mac. His patronage of Ocean Colour Scene said it all. He’s the Margaret Thatcher of music. Sorry, Spence. | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 145 Registered: 08-2004 |
People are lazy & stupid. Correct. But stupid & lazy enough to buy something they don't want because of the size or quality of a display. I have my doubts. It is akin to buying something by how nice the sleeve is. If size was all important they wouldn't have tried to faze out vinyl. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 87 Registered: 05-2005 |
Yeah I know what you mean, but the press as always have a lot to do with his persona. When I was young, Weller's opinions didn't come into it, it was the feeling, I was too young too care, I still don't care. The Mod/ska revival that happened in 79-81 was such an exciting time for me, the image, the music everything albeit retro was so brilliant. I like him for his music first, and as a public figure second, howver I don't agree with everything he says, same for MORRISSEY, but at leaset Weller has the balls to say it. Regards Ocean Colour Scene, (I was asked to join the group in '93 ahem), I'm not into them at all, but they were a hard working group, whatever you think of them, they made their luck. I had a good friend who used to support co-headline with David Gray many moons ago, he also had an album produced by John Leckie, it was all there for him, on a plate, but he suffered from lazybastarditis, he couldn't make his own luck/destiny if his life depended on it, where as you could argue that Weller, Messrs Blunt and OCS (whether you like them or not, made their own luck). I think there's room for everybody, Weller's remark about Blunt made me laugh, as veryone else in the limelight is scard to say what they think of him incase they're sitting next to his table at next year's Brits, however even James Blunt, if he makes people happy, so what, if he earns pots of money out of it, so what, we all could have been someone, I'm not into him but he's there, life's too short to be bitter, but I ad mire the likes of Weller and Moz as that's what I grew up with, they are part of me and its a great place to be! Its all subjective innit? | ||
| gareth w Member Username: Gareth Post Number: 31 Registered: 05-2005 |
Morrissey’s solo stuff stands up a lot better than people give it credit for in my opinion. I probably play his solo stuff more than I play Smiths stuff these days. ‘Vauxhall and I’ is a tremendous album and ‘You are the Quarry’ has some great moments too. He’s a complete one off and one of the funniest men in music too. His quotes are like a breath of fresh air. I don't see him ever getting a Brit though. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 89 Registered: 05-2005 |
Vauxhall and I is a beautiful chunk o vinyl! | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 152 Registered: 05-2005 |
Yes Jerry, people really are "stupid & lazy enough to buy something they don't want because of the size or quality of a display". I've done it myself. I bought some Flaming Lips album in the late 90s that was hyped to all hell, especially by Uncut. I already knew I did not much like them having seen their live show a couple of years earlier and thinking it was one of the most overblown and pretentious I had ever seen. But I bought the album because I thougt 50,000 music critics can't be wrong. Well, they were. The album isn't bad; it's just unbelievably overrated and my life would not be any worse off, and 15 pounds richer, if I had not bought it. | ||
| Graham Twyford Member Username: Graham_twyford Post Number: 30 Registered: 05-2005 |
Gareth - couldn't agree more with you about Paul Weller. The fact that he HATES REM doesn't help either. He'll just crow about any scruffy, working class-looking band who swear a lot and refuse to smile. Because they MEAN it. Mind you, that James Blunt comment is the funniest thing I've ever heard him say! I also think Coldplay get a raw deal. They've written some great songs, especially on their first 2 albums (their latest album is poor). The fact that they seem to be fairly nice blokes probably doesn't do them any favours. It's not their fault that there music suddenly appealed to the masses. I doubt Chris Martin sat down at the beginning and said 'Right, we're gonna write for housewives and mothers, OK?'! | ||
| Paul Wright Member Username: Wallaby Post Number: 11 Registered: 05-2005 |
Let's be honest, we would all be delighted if the GBs got Coldplay's sales instead of just 20 years of good reviews. We would be delighted, wouldn't we? Wouldn't we? Coldplay seem like quite, nice rather dull guys. There are worse things. And Chris Martin seems genuinely amazed that he is married to a film star. The music is ok - not to the point that I would buy it, because I can fill my need to hear their music by just walking around and catching it off tv, radio etc. Paul Weller is over-hyped. And I can't stand his attitude myself. Smug, self-satisfied hypocrit if you ask me. Somehow I missed James Blunt for the first 3 months. Wish I had carried on like that. | ||
| XY765 Member Username: Judge Post Number: 9 Registered: 01-2006 |
In reply to Gareth W's comment about Morrissey's solo work not getting enough credit I'm not so sure, I think the quality of his lyrics since after Viva Hate have been mediocre at times and atrocious at others. I'd pick the worst Smiths album (Meat is Murder maybe?) over any of his solo material, including Viva Hate. I saw him touring You are the Quarry last year in Dublin and he played There is a Light That Never Goes Out twice! I nearly asked for a refund...though he did do a great version of Redondo Beach by Patti Smith, now that was the best thing he's done in a good while..I don't have any time for Paul Weller either, just never got into him...always sounded like he was trying to be Ray Davies for me... | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 90 Registered: 05-2005 |
I think Paul Weller would be the first to admit that he's a smug bastard, some of the greatest musical icons of our time have been smug self righteous bastards! Dig? | ||
| abigail law Member Username: Abigail Post Number: 34 Registered: 06-2005 |
paul weller has been dead since 1980. i remember at my school you were either a jam fan or a clash fan, the nasty little-englander tory shits were all jam fans whilst those actually intersted in learning or the world around them were clash fans. this is hardly a fool-proof analysis of the music but it tells a story. even when releasing dross, morrissey is worth a thousand chris martins | ||
| Matt Ellis Member Username: Matt_ellis Post Number: 52 Registered: 11-2004 |
I have to disagree in part with Abigail - he lost it in 1996. I've always been dissapointed that folks don't rate his first solo record 'Paul Weller'. Even huge fans of Weller I've spoken to don't seem to rate it highly enough. Loads of Acid-Jazzy/funk influences, 19 jazz chord changes in most songs. Then he went (rightfully) to the height of his solo fame with Wildwood. Since then he has unsuccessfully recycled OCS-alike stuff. I agree with Spence he knows he's smug. A memorable Weller lyric for me will always be "I don't give two F's about your review" | ||
| Matt Ellis Member Username: Matt_ellis Post Number: 53 Registered: 11-2004 |
I forgot to add to the above - did Weller have a stylistic joke from 1983-1988 I could never decide the answer! | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 91 Registered: 05-2005 |
Erm, whoa! oops I'm going underground! No, I understand the coments about Weller, whole heartedly. Weller hasn't been dead since 1980, with respect that's absolute bollocks. I admit to thinking that after Money Go Round '83, everything Weller was involved in was pretty shit until 1993, Similar 10 year sabbatical that David Bowie had after Let's Dance '83 which was ropey, it wasn't until '93 - '94 that Bowie actually gave us something more than Tin Macine. but getting back to it, like I repeatedly say its subjective, but the man is an icon of worth, as is Morrissey, although, Morrissey has probably been much more consistent delivering quality stuff for over 20 years now, with and without the Smiths. Back to the thread, I am pleased it was Weller who got recognised, he is responsible for the Brits in many ways, and let us not forget that if it wasn't for The Jam, Johnny Marr was in love with The Jam, you wouldn't have had the Smiths, and so on...And re Abigail's coment about Clash fans on one side and Jam fans on the other, sorry but I never saw that dividing line, I must have missed that one! | ||
| TROU Member Username: Trou Post Number: 12 Registered: 05-2005 |
Whatever you think about Paul Weller, he mades 'Setting sons 'a really important and still brilliant album for me. I haven't really heard his productions after the Jam. I've always like the few quotes I've heard of him and his comments on Blunt only confirms . For me he seems to be a good guy but perhaps I've missed something... | ||
| Peter Collins Member Username: Tyroneshoelaces Post Number: 63 Registered: 05-2005 |
I actually preferred The Jam to The Clash, but I'm of a very left-wing persuasion, so I don't think Abigail's rule of thumb works for me. Having said that, I've always rather hated Paul Weller because he just seems to say the first thing that comes into his head and he isn't really that interesting. As for the whole awards thing - why should we be surprised? I just ignore all this stuff. I couldn't tell you the name of a Coldplay song, I thought I Predict A Riot was catchy, but the wife has the lp and that is the height of it by a long long way. Isn't this just the way of the thing - bands have been hyped and over-hyped since time immemorial. The good thing about now is that we have the internet to spread the word, for downloads and for buying cheaply. There are lots and lots and lots of niches and they're all pretty accessible one way or another, which to me means we can safely ignore these dastardly self-serving awards and get on with listening to what we like. | ||
| Adrian P Member Username: Adp Post Number: 10 Registered: 05-2005 |
Kevin Coyne's photo diary from The Brits is in The Guardian today (couldn't find it in the online version, sorry) - he seemed especially pleased to meet James Blunt. | ||
| Adrian P Member Username: Adp Post Number: 11 Registered: 05-2005 |
er, I meant Wayne Coyne, obviously... | ||
| jerry hann Member Username: Jerry_h Post Number: 52 Registered: 07-2005 |
Andy Kershaw was a big fan of Kevin Coyne can't say I really got into him, any one a big fan out there | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 96 Registered: 05-2005 |
Not Wayne County?! | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 164 Registered: 03-2005 |
Here in the States, the Clash always seemed to be the "punk" choice for the imported beer set. You knew about the Jam if you really liked music and were paying attention. I'm referring to the period of the Jam's first 4 albums. Today, I can't really say whether I'd get that much of a charge out of those old Weller projects. He seemed to be too much stuck on being a Mod between 1963 and 1966, either emulating what they created or what they listened to. I'd rather just listen to the Action, the Artwoods, the Small Faces, the Who, the Creation and the Smoke. Then there's the aptly named Style Council . . . . | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 100 Registered: 05-2005 |
Tell you what though, say what u like about the man, he's (Weller) ceretainly got people talking on this thread!! and I'd thought we'd killed it! | ||
| Hamish Walke Member Username: Hamish Post Number: 7 Registered: 05-2005 |
The Clash for me every time. Anyway, this a G-B's board so can I go back to Paul Wright's earlier comment that we wish our beloved band had achieved Coldplay's sales? Well I really really don't. I can't see any hugely successful band like Coldplay ever producing something as emotive, literate and moving as Liberty Belle. For me, a lot of the G-Bs genius is that they were always striving quite desperately for something, be it love, success, recognition or whatever. Yes, Robert and Grant deserve small fortunes and worldwide recognition but, paradoxically, if they had achieved that then I doubt they would have deserved it. I love the G-Bs story exactly as it is. I also love the fact I don't have to visit Wembley Stadium to see them! | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 153 Registered: 08-2004 |
Listened to Setting Sons last night. Magnificent. Private Hell is one of my favourites. What seems to be overlooked is Bruce Foxtons songwriting, Smithers -Jones/Innocent Man are both as good as Wellers efforts. As for dead since 1980, the run of singles from Tube Station to Beat Surrender is unbeatable. Snap is back in the shops, thanks to The Brits, it's a peerless compilation, one of the first records I ever bought. |