| Author | Message | ||
     Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1792 Registered: 01-2005 |
I've avoided the double disc versions of Murmur and Reckoning (as I've got the better sounding gold disc versions of each), but since I've got only a lousy 1985 era cd of Fables this is on my short list: http://www.amazon.com/Fables-Reconstruct ion-25th-Anniversary-R-E-M/dp/tracks/B00 3M70P1M/ref=dp_tracks_all_1#disc_1 | ||
| Pat Boland Member Username: Pat_boland Post Number: 66 Registered: 05-2005 |
Great news indeed. 'Fables..' and 'Murmur' are the only R.E.M. albums that I can still listen to from start to finish. By the way, the gold disc versions of the first two must be incredible if they sound better than the reissues. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1800 Registered: 01-2005 |
Pat, they do! One month to go before I pop for the Fables reissue. I hope it's as great an improvement as the double disc Tallulah reissue was!! | ||
| joe Member Username: Dogmansuede Post Number: 730 Registered: 07-2006 |
i never bought reckoning, but it's nearing the top of the list. should i not bother? i think i've just got the 96 reissue with moon river and some live bits and bobs at the end? (and the original lp, which is a little bit heavenly) | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 680 Registered: 10-2008 |
i will be buying this, i have murmur and reckoning double discs but this looks far better as the extra disc is not some botched together live set but some demos which hopefully contrast with the joe boyd finished article. speaking of double discs, treated myself to birthday pressie of raw power by iggy and the stooges (original bowie mix) which by my recoking i have now bought 4 times. this latest one, once on vinyl circa 77-78, again on cd about 1990, the iggy mix circal 2000 | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 681 Registered: 10-2008 |
that should of course read 4 times in total (3 bowie mixes and one iggy mix) | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1803 Registered: 01-2005 |
Kevin, were the live sets on the double disc Murmur and Reckoning that bad? I have the 1982 concert boot Carnival Of Sorts, but that's about it as far as live REM. "Carnival Of Sorts" Great Dane Records (GDR CD 9020) Recorded: Merlins in Madison, WI (April 24, 1982) Quality: Excellent Format: CD (ADD) Released: October, 1990 Tracks Gardening At Night/9-9/Ages Of You/Shaking Through/Laughing/ Romance/Sitting Still/Pretty Persuasion/That Beat/Catapult/ Radio Free Europe/Wolves, Lower/Carnival Of Sorts (Boxcars)/ White Tornado/West Of The Fields/Stumble-Skank/ There She Goes Again | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 688 Registered: 10-2008 |
Michael, its just live CDs I cant stand. I am on record here several times debating how useless and dispensible I find them. In fact, there is a live CD with Raw Power (which I mention above) and it has not been removed from the cd cover. Apparently its an excellent recording, and it probably is, but I just cant be arsed!! | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1804 Registered: 01-2005 |
Kevin, I'm on the fence regardng live rock cd's. A few bands sound better live (The Allman Brothers and Talking Heads)and they have the chops to do it well and are recorded at decent shows. Robyn Hitchcock does have the chops but he also has his bizarre and entertaining between song banter that elevates his live cd's/boots over his studio albums. Plus he has a huge play list to choose from. I'll give you that a lot of live albums cd'd/DVD's are average to poor at best though. Aimee Mann's live album cd/DVD was shockingly medicore at best. Live jazz cd's make more sense. | ||
| Paul B. Member Username: Paul_b Post Number: 52 Registered: 10-2004 |
The R.E.M.'Live at The Olympia' CD is one of the best live records I've heard in years. You can feel the energy from the audience and band coming through the music. As far a s live REM is concerned, its a good place to start. Avoid the 'R.E.M. Live' from 97. | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 1816 Registered: 09-2006 |
I saw the Olympia set on the library shelf just the other day but passed it by due to bad memories of 'R.E.M. Live.' I might actually give it a try next time I spy it there. Michael, I found the live set on the Murmer Deluxe edition to be pretty enjoyable. I've got no special thing for or against live records - there've been plenty of foul ones, but, just off the top of my head, in the good-to-great realm: James Brown Live at the Apollo Vols. 1 & 2 (he's actually done many good and great live albums) Dylan/The Band - Before the Flood The Name of this Band is Talking Heads Stop Making Sense (video) Whatstheirfaces - That Striped Sunlight Sound Handsome Family - Live at Schuba's Tavern Linton Kwesi Johnson - Live With the Dub Band and Live in Paris Radiohead - Can't remember what it was called, but it was pretty good U2- Under a Blood Red Sky Pere Ubu - Apocalypse Now Daft Punk - can't remember the exact name of the album either, but I like it a lot Neil - Time Fades Away, Live Rust, Weld, Year of the Horse, Road Rock vol. 1 Ramones - It's Alive, Loco Live If I went and scanned my CD shelves I'm sure I could find quite a few more. | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 1817 Registered: 09-2006 |
Gil Scott-Heron & Brian Jackson - It's Your World (was just listening to this one) Husker Du - Land Speed Record, The Living End 801 - Live Minutemen - Ballot Result Van Morrison - It's Too Late to Stop Now Marshall Crenshaw - My Truck is My Home...Live Bowie - Stage Agreed with you about jazz albums, Michael...there are many Monk, Davis, Parker, Coltrane, etc. albums I could list. | ||
| Paul B. Member Username: Paul_b Post Number: 53 Registered: 10-2004 |
The live set on both re-releases are good, but they are one in many live recordings from that era. I am looking forward to the 'Athens Demos' though. These re-releases are eagerly anticipated by me especially, Peter Buck is on record as saying that he didn't care much for 'Around The Sun' but the demos should blow everyone away.. | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1013 Registered: 08-2004 |
I'm with you on Robyn Hitchcock, Michael. He manages the surreal without sounding overly-poncey. I guess it's down to whether you're willing to go along with the ride or not. The Soft Boys 'Live At The Portland Arms' is a particular favourite. Go-betweens - Live In London is an exhausting listen that doesn't really capture the night that well for me. It's a real shame cos there's nothing wrong with it at all. The Who - Live At Leeds is good fun even in it's expanded form. R.E.M. - Live At The Olympia is great. I'm with you on that one, Paul. I've heard some outtakes from R.E.M.'s Around The Sun & it's no great shakes. Or indeed that different. I'm sure I've mentioned it here before but it still stands that The Cure's 'Entreat' & 'Concert' are great documents on a genuinely great if sometimes erratic band. How about Suicide's '23 Minutes Over Brussels' which is a low rent cathartic experience. Bob Dylan - Live 66 At The Albert Hall - You know the story. I've got The Stones 'Get Yer Ya-Ya's Out' which kind of does the job for me. Echo & The Bunnymen - Live At The RAH'83 - is simply magical. A band at their creative & playing peak. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1808 Registered: 01-2005 |
Paul B. and Jerry, Thanks for your reviews of R.E.M. - Live At The Olympia, I just ordered it along with Echo & The Bunnymen - Live At The Royal Albert Hall'83. Here are some of my favorite live recordings. Allman Brothers Band - Live at the Fillmore East (plus the live cuts from the subsequent Eat a Peach album). Derek and The Dominoes - In Concert and Live at The Fillmore, recorded from four shows over two days in October of 1970. Clapton's solo on Why Does Love Have To Be So Sad from In Concert is blissful and maybe his best live solo ever. The version on Live at The Fillmore album isn't as good. I love how Bobby Whitlock's Hammond B3 and Clapton's Stratocaster mesh together. Surprizingly great even without Duane Allman. Later 1970 gigs by the Dominoes weren't nearly so good due to the bands increasingly nasty drug habbits. The Name of this Band is Talking Heads John Cale - Fragments Of A Rainey Season 10,000 Maniacs - MTV Unplugged Au Pairs - Live In Berlin. One of my alltime favorite obscure bands. I don't care if they lifted a lot of their sound from Gang Of Four. Little Feat - Waiting For Columbus (double Disc version released in 2002) Warren Zevon - Stand In The Fire Bob Seger - Live Bullet. Included not because of of the quality of the performances or skill of the players, but because I was at Cobo Hall in September of 1975 the night when the bulk of the tracks were recorded that ended up on the album. I had a blast, and my cheering somewhat drunk voice is buried somewhere in the mix (I snuck in a fifth of Canadian Club and left the empty bottle propped up on the folded seat after the show). | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 691 Registered: 10-2008 |
I'm sorry, but the way this topic is progressing, all its doing is highlighting how many shit live CDs there are that I had either forgotten about, or was oblivious to. The only live CDs that anybody needs are the Velvets Live 69, and Misty In Roots Live At Counter Eurovision, everything else is stuff and nonsense :-) | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 1818 Registered: 09-2006 |
Forgot about the Velvets record...that is a great one, and the Quine-recorded live box grows on me with each listen. Agreed on Stand in the Fire. Television - Live at the Old Waldorf. The Blow-up has its moments, too. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2371 Registered: 03-2005 |
I've been avoiding this thread since I'm not an REM fan. But I can weigh in on live recordings. I definitely agree with Kevin about the Velvets live 69 album. That may be the greatest live guitar rock band album forever. The Velvets' record hints at what might be necessary for a good or great live album. First, the artist in question has a hard time getting decent recordings or performances in the studio. Second, a few new or unique original songs are included--the more the better. Third, the recording sounds LIVE, i.e., there's a certain intensity, a certain distortion level. Fourth, the band actually has a different take on their familiar songs when live as compared with the studio versions. I like the Go Bees' Live in London set very much because of the surprising material that it includes and because I was there but if I got my hands on the raw recordings I'd master them much hotter. What we all hated on "Oceans Apart" is what is needed for a live recording: hot sound with some distortion. Certain people issued live recordings as their official release. James Brown and the jazz people Michael mentioned fall into this category. Ricky Nelson--I'm not a great fan--revived his career with a live album of mostly new material. These releases will often be amongst the best of the live canon. What consistently sucks completely is when bands try to recreate their studio records on stage. The most disappointing show I ever attended was the Cocteau Twins in Los Angeles, I think in 1988 or 1989. I already had all their CD releases. I assumed they could not create the miasmic sound and was looking forward to a stripped-down performance that gave Liz Fraser and Robin Guthrie a chance to show us what they were doing underneath all of that atmosphere. And I wanted a drummer. I was so disappointed by the slavish level of copying of their recorded versions that I basically stopped listening to them from that time forward after having been a pretty heavy duty fan for several years. I'm not a big Wilco fan but I get the impression that they re-work their music onstage. IMO that is an essential trait for a great live band and frequently for a great live album. Kevin, I've never heard any live Stooges but if I were you I'd at least pull out that live disc you have for one listen. In his prime Iggy was basically the James Brown of punk. He gave a no-holds-barred performance. Absolutely nothing was off limits. And the band were clearly very capable. It could turn out to be a gem if they were having a good night and the sound is decent. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1809 Registered: 01-2005 |
Allen, Great call on Television - Live at the Old Waldorf. I've got it and will revisit it today as well as my copy of the Velvets live 69 album. A remastered and expanded URGH: A Music War cd would be nice!!! | ||
| Andrew Kerr Member Username: Andrew_k Post Number: 564 Registered: 04-2005 |
While not remembering why Kevin dislikes live albums so much, I can't really see why anyone would take such a line. Sure, they are some absolutely awful ones out there, but that applies to studio records too. Personally I hate live albums where the audience gets to be heard too much (Elvis Costello Live at the El Mocambo and all those 'yee-haws'), but on the other hand Dylan's live 1966 is an amazing document. The atmosphere gives the concert a certain edge and 'Like A Rolling Stone' is incredible in its intensity. And the idea of a band overdubbing in the studio afterwards is a travesty; apparently Thin Lizzy's "Live and Dangerous" was almost all re-recorded. I have no idea why as I saw them at the time and they sounded exactly like that... I'm with everyone on the Velvets '69, but it is interesting to note that Sterling Morrison hated it ! He said it was completely unrepresentative of the live sound of the group at that time. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1811 Registered: 01-2005 |
I'll have to check out Dylan's live 1966 that both Jerry and Andrew checked off. The only live Dylan I have is the two disc Vol. 6 Live 1964 Concert At Philharmonic Hall, which I think is great. I saw Dylan 24 years ago when he was touring with Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers. Spent $50.00 for a 4th row ticket for a scalpper, which was a lot back then. It was well worth it. | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1019 Registered: 08-2004 |
Back on topic. Some of the Fables demos are available via different sources: http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/1 7386/122354 http://consequenceofsound.net/2010/06/29 /check-out-unreleased-r-e-m-demo-of-auct ioneer-another-engine-cos-premiere/ http://emicat.edgeboss.net/qtime/emicat/ rem/fables/audio/rem_d1_005_old-man-kens ey_300.mov | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 1967 Registered: 10-2004 |
Derailing the thread once more... Randy - I saw the Cocteau Twins twice around the time of Heaven or Las Vegas, and I too, though they were kind of dull. I enjoyed it to a point, but just wasn't wowed. But then I saw them again in '96, their last tour, and they were absolutely phenomenal. That time, they had a human drummer (!), they ditched one of the extra guitarists, and with Robyn having clearly shed a ton of weight, they played with abundant energy and passion. At the end of the day, the songs weren't radically different from the record versions, but it was an infinitely better way to experience the Cocteau Twins live than the staid 1990-era shows. As for the Go-Betweens Live in London - obviously, I wasn't there, so I don't know how representative the recording is... But despite generally great song selection, the performances on the recording sound stiff and a bit uninspired. The whole thing just sounds so... polite. I'm really not a fan of the live show on Striped Sunlight Sound, either. Again, it's so polite. My favorite Go-Betweens live document is that show from '83 that was done shortly after Vickers joined. | ||
| cosmo vitelli Member Username: Cosmo Post Number: 298 Registered: 05-2005 |
I f***ing hate live albums with the honourable exception of If You Want Blood,You've Got It by ACDC | ||
| cosmo vitelli Member Username: Cosmo Post Number: 299 Registered: 05-2005 |
which was recorded in Glasgow I believe | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1021 Registered: 08-2004 |
Talking of I Believe: http://atlanta.metromix.com/music/articl e/exclusive-hear-an-unreleased/2041189/c ontent The demo here sounds like an early version of that very song. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3603 Registered: 05-2005 |
I mostly dislike live albums, but there are a few great ones. Somebody up above dissed Live & Dangerous. It's a great record! | ||
| Andrew Kerr Member Username: Andrew_k Post Number: 565 Registered: 04-2005 |
Re: "Live and Dangerous". Yep that was me, but I just mentioned that apparently the whole thing was practically re-recorded in the studio. I'm still waiting for Kevin and Cosmo to explain why they dislike live albums so much. Just intrigued in the sense that I can't really see why anyone could adopt such a Stalinist approach towards a whole genre of recorded music. Do they include classic jazz recordings in this for example ? I mean where would we be without the 47 versions of Coltrane doing 'My Favourite Things' ? | ||
| cosmo vitelli Member Username: Cosmo Post Number: 300 Registered: 05-2005 |
I definitely dont include jazz recordings.Simply stated I have very rarely heard a live album that is anything more than a badly recorded set of inferior versions of songs I love (and I should also say that I love going to gigs). | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 708 Registered: 10-2008 |
couldnt agree more cosmo | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 709 Registered: 10-2008 |
got my order in for the fables reissue. seems like it is a lush package going by the picture on the amazon website. just as well, cos £12.99 is a bit steep for an album most of us probably already have. speaking of 25th anniversaries, i came across this today. http://www.spin.com/spin25/125-best-albu ms-past-25-years achtung baby at no1? they cannot be serious!! have vaguely heard of this magazine but have never saw it on sale in the uk. is it the american version of uncut and mojo? | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1023 Registered: 08-2004 |
If U2 are top of their pops? It must be a fu-Q mag for Americano's. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3610 Registered: 05-2005 |
Andrew, I remember reading somewhere (OK, it was Kerrang magazine) in the 80s that Live and Dangerous was 25% reworked in the studio. So maybe it should be called 75% Live and Dangerous? Kevin, Spin sort of styled itself as the indie, younger Rolling Stone when it started in the 80s. It was set up by Bob Guccione Jr using money his father, Bob Snr, had made with Penthouse magazine. (I acquired this knowledge through the music side of the equation, I hasten to add!) | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1816 Registered: 01-2005 |
I've got the Spin alternative record guide (that was published in 1995). It includes their top 100, and here is it's top 10: 1. Ramones - Ramones 2. Public Enemy - It Takes A Nation 3. Velvet Underground - The VU & Nico 4. Husker Du - Zen Arcade 5. Nirvana - Nevermind 6. Patti Smith - Horses 7. Big Star - Radio City 8. R.E.M. - Murmur 9. Sonic Youth - Daydream Nation 10.X- Wild Gift And somewhat down the list but still in the top 100: 71. Go-Betweens - 1979-90 86. U2 - Achtung Baby Spin must have thought Achtung Baby aged like a bottle of Chateau Lafite Rothschild, jumping past numerous albums that were released since 1985 that were rated above it in the 1995 record guide. | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1025 Registered: 08-2004 |
It must have been a genuine sympathy vote. No-one likes back pain. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1820 Registered: 01-2005 |
I gave up on U2 after Achtung Baby (which I thought was half way decent), but seeing them live at the Pontiac Silverdome was the final straw. Of course at the time I was deep into the shoegazer bands, and U2 seemed way too bombastic. Plus Bono was doin his Fly thing, which I thought was pathetic at best. | ||
| fsh Member Username: Fsh Post Number: 212 Registered: 05-2005 |
Achtung Baby = U2 doing 'IRONY' ... cutting down the rather nice Joshua Tree. I think they even issued a press release telling the public they were now being 'ironic' as opposed to their previous earnest 1980's version of themselves (how ironic is that!?). They've always lacked subtlety which conversely is what I like about the go-betweens. I saw U2 play in Dublin last year and everything was made so blindingly OBVIOUS to the audience ... is there a war on terror going on ... why can't we all live peacefully together ... why is Bono wearing a blindfold ... doesn't he look like a prisoner ...is that what Amnesty International do? I guess when you're a well greased global machine operating transnationally, you're dealing with the lowest common denominators but they (U2) do underestimate their audience somewhat imho. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2381 Registered: 03-2005 |
Excellent summation of U2 fsh. But I don't think they underestimate their audience generally. Like you said, they're a "greased global machine operating transnationally." Their audience is HUGE and the only way to get that big an audience is to reach for a lot of people who are not very . . . I haven't come across very many people who do a good job of mixing music and political statements. Woody Guthrie is the gold standard there and I think McCarthy were great. I imagine a lot of people will cite Billy Bragg though he's never really done it for me. But most musicians who do it seem only capable of presenting musical bumper stickers and give the impression that they don't really know what they're talking about. U2 are super rich; they aren't going to be able to tackle anything truly relevant to their audience because they honestly can't remember what it's like to be in their shoes. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 714 Registered: 10-2008 |
my friend was a massive u2 fan. he asked me to go see them at edinburgh playhouse circa 1982/1983. at this point they were moderately successful,still relatively hip, but the second album had stiffed. i wasnt too keen to go, but we went to gigs together so i tagged along. by the second or third song i was at the end of my tether, they had morphed from an energetic spiky band to a proto stadium band with bono now apparently mick jagger. by the time he was climbing up speaker rigs and crawling along them on his hands and knees i was begging my friend to go, and was voicing my disapproval at this treachery:-) he wasnt too happy with me and from memory i think i braved it till the end. that night was probably no3 in my "worst gigs that friends dragged me to", no2 was gary numan when he was massive,probably about 1980, although to be fair, as much as i dislike him the song "cars" still sounds fantastic today. no1 by an incredibly large margin was dire straits, again about 1980. i got my revenge on the dire straits fan though when he had to endure a cramps gig. i think it was about 1980, glasgow apollo if i remember correctly. the crowd were baying for blood, and lux interior went all kamikaze and jumped head first into this crowd of glaswegian animals before defiantly displaying his manhood for all to see. glasgow crowds are legendarily hard to please,especially if groups were unknown,and i remember both suicide(1978?) and the specials (1979?) being bottled and booed whilst supporting the clash. wonder what became of both these bands? :-) sorry went a bit off topic there! | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 1489 Registered: 08-2006 |
I know harping on these best-of [insert time frame here] lists is like shooting fish in a barrel, but the "Achtung, Baby" pick is just weird. I don't hate the album, and if it placed somewhere in the teens or 20s I wouldn't bat an eye, but the best album in the last 25 years? I haven't read Spin in years, but in the old days they would have at least picked something weird-but-hip, not weird-but-dull. If they really wanted to make a statement, they should have picked "Pop." | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1823 Registered: 01-2005 |
I know he doesn't write a lot of politcal songs, but I'll give Peter Gabriel a double thumbs up approval rating for "Biko". Kate Bush also had some nice moments with "Breathing" and to a lesser extent with "The Dreaming","Army Dreamers" and "Pull Out The Pin". | ||
| Paul B. Member Username: Paul_b Post Number: 54 Registered: 10-2004 |
For those so inclined,'The Power of Independent Trucking' blog has the streamed versions of the tacks available for download. http://thepowerofindependenttrucking.blo gspot.com/2010/07/rem-fables-demos-unlea shed.html | ||
| Andrew Kerr Member Username: Andrew_k Post Number: 569 Registered: 04-2005 |
For me U2 were all downhill after 'Boy' and the first time I saw them live at Strathclyde Uni in Glasgow ('81?). I probably thought they were the future of rock'n'roll for that moment, but the fall was rapid! 'October' is absolutely awful, sounding if they couldn't write any actual songs and the second time live was all stadium posing, even though it was at an inside venue (Tiffanys in Glasgow) and remains one of the few gigs I have walked out of. I think the crunch came with Bono soaking the crowd with champagne, which was a present from Jim Kerr of Simple Minds. Somebody once wrote that U2 might have stayed interesting if they had continued on the European art rock road, instead of heading off down the rockist American path? | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 1829 Registered: 01-2005 |
Andrew wrote: >Somebody once wrote that U2 might have stayed interesting if they had >continued on the European art rock road, instead of heading off down the rockist >American path? Added to that you had Bono waving the flags during the War tour and it seemed pretty calculated to these eyes. I liked about 1/4 of their songs per album after October, and that's not a very high ratio in my estimation. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 1972 Registered: 10-2004 |
I LOVE U2's first album, Boy. To me it's a near flawless debut, full of energy and interesting hooks, and some really great guitar playing. After that it's kind of diminishing returns with the next few albums. The one thing I really have never understood is why Achtung Baby remains so highly revered. To me it was the moment when U2 decided to stop sounding like U2 and started sounding super generic. As much as I dislike Joshua Tree, at least it still had a sound that was distinctly U2. I agree with Randy that successfully mixing music and politics is a tricky thing. McCarthy definitely nailed it better than anyone I can think of. I also think the Minutemen and Gang of Four did it well with their "the political is the personal" approach. Crass were way to literal, obvious, and preachy - I mean, c'mon, try and at least be a little poetic! The Subhumans meant well, but they were definitely preaching to the choir, and again a bit too no frills and obvious. The Dead Kennedys at least had a twisted sense of humor about it. It's really trendy these days to rip the Clash for being disingenuous when they delved into politics, but I've always dug their song "Washington Bullets." I LOVE the Style Council, even though songs like "The Whole Point of No Return" were a tad naive. But at least their blending of politics with melodic, soul/jazz pop was better and more ironic than punk rock belly-aching. | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 1829 Registered: 09-2006 |
For years and years I've always had a few U2 albums in my collection, and have always enjoyed and admired them when I played them...though I didn't play them that frequently, and the enjoyment and admiration was often at a bit of a distance. About two months ago, for whatever reason, I began bingeing on them for the first time ever, and it was pretty extensive - through a combination of the library and the CD store I made my way through nearly all of their catalog, including best-ofs and reissue bonus CDs, and I've read more interviews with them in those two months than I have in the past 30 years. I'll avoid going into the political aspects in any detail, as I've always found that even among friendly acquaintances political discussions can be like wading into muck. I will say that in general I admire them even more than I have in the past (even Bono, a sticking point for many), and my enjoyment, which was centered around Musicman the Edge's dynamics, flow, lyricism, invention, etc. has grown by leaps and bounds. That distance just isn't there any more. Achtung Baby isn't my favorite, but it's got about an EP's worth of fine songs. Their "pop irony" period produced somewhat patchy results overall, but "Zooropa" sounds much better as a whole than it used to, and the best-of from that period is pretty darn killer. "Joshua Tree" has also improved greatly for me. | ||
| TROU Member Username: Trou Post Number: 257 Registered: 05-2005 |
U2, I don't say bad things on them only because they are Go-Betweens fans... | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 1491 Registered: 08-2006 |
I've always thought of U2 largely as a singles band, mainly because there wasn't a single record that grabbed me start to finish, while I enjoyed certain tracks a lot. That said, I think "All You Can't Leave Behind" is the closest they've come to really terrific end-to-end record, mainly because it seemed like they were tossing it off a bit and not aiming for a Big Statement. And I still think "Beautiful Day" is the very definition of a perfect pop anthem. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 721 Registered: 10-2008 |
even brian eno couldnt make them any good. then again, after a decade of sheer magnificance in the 70's, when everything he touched turned to gold, he's been a bit hit and miss himself with his own work and other productions. | ||
| cosmo vitelli Member Username: Cosmo Post Number: 308 Registered: 05-2005 |
Brian Eno wouldnt have made them any good at any time (although he could have improved all our lives by going back in time in a Terminator style and killing Bono while he was still at school dreaming of one day ruling the world and suing people over a hat) |