| Author | Message | ||
     skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 947 Registered: 10-2008 |
yes, its not even december but the new issue of mojo has their album of the year poll. top 10 1 john grant - queen of denmark 2 arcade fire - the suburbs 3 mgmt - congratulations 4 edwyn collins - losing sleep 5 the black keys - brothers 6 paul weller - wake up the nation 7 midlake - the courage of others 8 phosphorescent - heres to taking it easy 9 the choral - butterfly 10 doug paisley - constant companion. pretty eclectic list as usual from mojo, but i'd be surprised to see nearly all of these in any other top 50, never mind top 10. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2011 Registered: 01-2005 |
Kev, Do you have Queen of Denmark? I bumped into Austin (who posts here once in a while) at the Gary Numan show last month, and Austin said it was his favorite album of the year as well. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 948 Registered: 10-2008 |
michael, dont have it, but gave it a cursory listen on napster. cant say it made much of an impression on me. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 950 Registered: 10-2008 |
bought my yearly edition of q magazine today,the one with the albums of the year round up. normally find this magazine a bit corporate, but their top 50 is arguably better than mojo's. and there is a bonus for me in that includes a large feature called "the lost boy", which claims to be the "story of the life and death of elliott smith by those who knew him best". 1 arcade fire- the suburbs 2 robert plant - band of joy 3 plan b - the defamation of strickland banks 4 laura marling - i speak because i can 5 vampire weekend - contra 6 john grant - queen of denmark 7 gorillaz - plastic beach 8 the national - high violet 9 paul weller - check the nation 10 mgmt - congratulations deerhunter, belle and sebastian,lcd soundsystem, grinderman, hot chip and edwyn collins all appear in the top 50 | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 953 Registered: 10-2008 |
uncut's turn now. looks like john grant is the "out of left field" album of the year for the british monthly music mags. although weller (unfathomably for me)is their critical darling. large stiff drinks at the ready for the unveiling of uncut's no1. ;-) 1 joanna newsom - have one on me 2 neil young - le noise 3 paul weller - wake up the nation 4 arcade fire - the suburbs 5 robert plant - band of joy 6 ariel pinks haunted graffiti - before today 7 john grant - queen of denmark 8 ali farka toure and toumani diabete - ali and toumani 9 lcd soundsystem - this is happening 10 grinderman - grinderman 2 just outside the top 10, drive by truckers, the national, and the fall reissues of the year have a predictable, although brilliant top 3 1 bowie - station to station 2 rolling stones - exile on main st 3 iggy and the stooges - raw power | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 956 Registered: 10-2008 |
i remember back in the late 70's early 80's, pre internet and monthly mags of course, i used to count the days all through december till the xmas editions of nme, melody maker and sounds would publish their albums of the year. it all seemed so simple back then, i felt i could predict the top 10 in them all fairly comfortably, albeit perhaps not in strict order. this year i mostly hadn't/haven't got a clue what will be in the lists for uncut, mojo, q, rolling stone, pitchfork etc. this week, while turning the pages of the review of the year issues of the first 3 mags listed above, i was struck by how many albums i either hadnt heard, or hadnt heard of the artist, or indeed had no wish to hear. this year, more than any other year i will really struggle to put together a top 10 of what we still term loosely as "rock" music. i suspect the small band of enthusiasts on this board will struggle as well, i'm basing that on what has been posted in the "what people are listening to" threads. that might be because there's just too damn much out there, new releases and reissues come flooding in every week. our lives are too busy to spend much time absorbing all this music properly, if it doesnt grab us after two listens it may never get the chance to win us over. i listened to the john grant album this morning and was pretty underwhelmed by its trad singer songwriter, piano/accoustic guitar based slush after two songs(i made it to track 9) and just cannot see what all the fuss is about this record. i doubt i will play it again, it could be a classic slow burner and it may well be my loss, but i think i'll take the gamble. for me personally, i suppose the warning signs this was a poor year for new rock music was there when i spent large amounts of time over the last 3 months of this year listening to old records by cabaret voltaire, tom verlaine/television and the fall. here's to next year! | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2017 Registered: 01-2005 |
Nice to see Paul Weller consistently landing in the Top 10. I don't own the new one yet, but I intend on getting it soon. Is it better then 22 Dreams? | ||
| frank bascombe Member Username: Frankb Post Number: 481 Registered: 01-2007 |
Surprised by the lists, I like you Kevin would wait for NME to anounce their LPs of the year and as you say you could probably guess.Surprised that John Grant is up there. In fact bought this when it first came out and was underwelmed. But have gone back to it and it does reveal itself over multiple listens and have been playing it more recently than before( before the lists came out) it is in the Rufus/Anthony and the johnsons territory but less pretentious.For me the best Lps have been the Arcade Fire, Gorillaz and the new EC. Actually the one that has most airplay in the family car is The Gaslight Anthem. I can't beleive uncut both Joanna Newsom and Neil Young are poor efforts. | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 1955 Registered: 09-2006 |
Agreed on the Arcade Fire, which is finally kicking in for me, though my liking for the Neil Young has only grown...that nexus of earnest and arty he does so well is all over Le Noise. | ||
| David Gagen Member Username: David_g Post Number: 333 Registered: 02-2007 |
Stornoway - Beachcomber's Windowsill | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 247 Registered: 02-2005 |
I won't be giving a second glance to any 2010 Top Ten list that fails to include 'Halcyon Digest' by Deerhunter. Life is simpler that way. | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 248 Registered: 02-2005 |
I may pick up the John Grant record to give it a fair shake, but I saw him open for Midlake and it didn't leave much of an impression other than tedium. Of course, it's not the kind of music that one can easily embrace [on first listen] standing in a crowded ballroom drinking beer. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2026 Registered: 01-2005 |
Guy, Rude crowds for an acoustic act sometimes need to STFU. Um, I guess I'm a touch sensitive on the subject after watching the Nick Drake documentary last night. Sorry about that. I also saw a rude crowd during an oh-so-quiet Departure Lounge set that was ruined by some drunks. | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 249 Registered: 02-2005 |
The crowd wasn't rude at the Midlake show that John Grant opened for, but it was crowded and it was a standing room venue. I listened to about half his set and then went downstairs to the bar/lounge to sit down for 45-minutes. It just wasn't the right environment to hear his music for the first time ever... it didn't help that it was a weeknight and I was pooped. Nothing gets me more angry than rude audience members. It doesn't take many and it doesn't have to be at a quiet folky performance. The last time I saw Roky Erickson at Maxwell's there was a tupperware party of chicks behind us carrying-on a shouting-level yakety-yak fest for the entire set. It was too crowded to move elsewhere. It seems impossible that a group of people could scream at each other over the roar of Roky and The Explosives for an hour straight, but they did. I'm not shy about telling people to shut the fuck up either. It can get confrontational, but since I'm RIGHT and they're WRONG it's usually worth the trouble and once you ask politely and the offenders get aggressive there will usually be some other people in the vicinity who help gang-up on the rude loudmouths. | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 250 Registered: 02-2005 |
BTW... I'm a big Tim Keegan and Departure Lounge fan. The first time I heard them was when they opened for Forster & McLennan at FEZ here in NYC; 26 June, 1999. It was a great night. I became an immediate fan and bought 'Out of Here' at the merch table that night. I've gotten a lot of mileage out of that album in the past 11 years. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2523 Registered: 03-2005 |
Total agreement about Homer Lounge/Departure Lounge though as usual for me I only discovered them once they were finished. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 964 Registered: 10-2008 |
the crowd at the wilco gig in glasgow last month were a noisy lot. not a problem during the loud songs, but annoying during the more reflective songs. then again, it was a glasgow crowd, and it was the barrowlands!! i was really surprised wilco chose this venue, more suited to primal scream, or flaming lips, or super furry animals - all of whom i have saw there in the last decade. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2028 Registered: 01-2005 |
Guy, Wasn't the Forster & McLennan gig at FEZ in NYC; 26 June, 1999 the one that Robert Vickers showed up to and played bass? I don't remember a CD-R of the FEZ show making the Tree/Brach/Leaf rounds back in the day. Does one exist? | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 965 Registered: 10-2008 |
Regarding Halcyon Digest by Deerhunter. It is a very good record, and will probably be in my top10, but does anybody else agree the running order spoils the overall enjoyment of the album? Songs like Revival and Sailing are too slow paced to be tracks 3 and 4, even more so given that Earthquake is a very sloooow opener. Mind you, Earthquake is possibly my favourite song on the album after the majestic Helicopter. | ||
| Mark Leydon Member Username: Mark_leydon Post Number: 318 Registered: 05-2005 |
Kev - agree with you that there are couple of surprising song sequences on Halcyon Digest. But overall the song quality is so high that it doesn't really impact on my enjoyment of the album. The two you mention, Helicopter and Earthquake, are just great - but my favourites are Desire Lines and the sublime closer He Would Have Laughed. Got tickets to their gig here in Sydney next Feb - and really looking foward to it. They are a terrific live band. Seeing The Fall tomorrow night for the first time in 20 years! | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 1533 Registered: 08-2006 |
Hmmm, I gotta give Deerhunter another chance, I think. I interviewed them a few years back and found them really nice guys. I actually talked to one of the guys - can't remember which one - informally afterward for about an hour about getting Cryptograms out, the costs of touring, etc. Very interesting. But I never liked that record, as much as I wanted to. I'll have to give the new one a chance. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2525 Registered: 03-2005 |
Kevin sent me one song--"Helicopter." Thank you Kevin. It's pleasant but doesn't knock me out. It reminds me a little of Flaming Lips although my exposure to Flaming Lips is limited to one album (Soft Bulletin). Unlike the Lips though it seems to be a bit too much sound and not enough song. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 970 Registered: 10-2008 |
ok, here's what i came up with in what could loosely be called the "rock" field, my god it was a struggle! i reckon only the aeriel pink album will be talked about in years to come. the rest are all nice albums, mostly by artists who have made better albums previously. 1 aeriel pinks haunted graffiti - before today 2 deerhunter - halcyon digest 3 phosphorescent - here's to taking it easy 4 lcd soundsystem - this is happening 5 drive by truckers - the big to-do dance/electronica etc, compilation and reissue albums to come later on. that will be a much more enjoyable task. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 979 Registered: 10-2008 |
pitchforks songs of the year. great to see it covering different genres. the top 20 especially has some great songs(and some i havent even heard like robyn, kanye west etc), the no1 was a pleasant surprise. http://pitchfork.com/features/staff-list s/7895-the-top-100-tracks-of-2010/1/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 980 Registered: 10-2008 |
from popmatters http://www.popmatters.com/pm/feature/134 604-the-best-70-albums-of-2010/ http://www.popmatters.com/pm/feature/134 604-the-best-70-albums-of-2010/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 981 Registered: 10-2008 |
from fact magazine http://www.factmag.com/2010/11/30/40-bes t-albums-of-2010-40-31/ another pleasant surprise at no1 - one of my "non rock" albums of the year | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 983 Registered: 10-2008 |
from quietus. i need to revisit that album by these new puritans. its been sneaking into a few lists. their reissue list is very eclectic, and probably the most interesting of all the lists i have read this year. and yet another pleasant surprise at no2 http://thequietus.com/articles/05391-qui etus-albums-of-the-year-2010 http://thequietus.com/articles/05437-com pilations-reissues-mixes-and-live-albums -best-of-2010 | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 984 Registered: 10-2008 |
from music ohm http://www.musicomh.com/music/features/2 010-top-50-albums-intro_1110.htm | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 985 Registered: 10-2008 |
clash magazine http://www.clashmusic.com/feature/clashs -top-40-albums-of-2010 | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 251 Registered: 02-2005 |
Michael B: Yes, Vickers joined them for several songs that night along with Will Rigby on snare (former dB's drummer). It was a really fun and satisfying show. I do have a recording of that set, downloaded from Dimeadozen a year or so ago. The fidelity is okay, but it's an "audience" tape so it isn't up to the quality of the Munich B2 Radio Broadcast. The other great recording I have from that tour is the show in Geislingen, Germany. That one sounds like a soundboard recording of the monitor mix; perfectly clear, heavier on vocals than guitar and the audience/applause is very remote-sounding. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2035 Registered: 01-2005 |
Guy, I have the Munich B2 Radio Broadcast, the 29/05/99 show in Geislingen, Dublin 4/06/99, the Grog Shop in Cleveland 10/06/99 and the one that I attended (The 7th House, Pontiac MI 11/06/99). All of these were tree/branch/leaf CD-R's from the old Tallulah folks. Can you burn me a CDR of the FEZ show in NYC? | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 986 Registered: 10-2008 |
Guy, spookily in tandem with this thread and Michael B's post above, the package you sent me arrived today - you are far too kind and I am overwhelmed at the time, care and devotion you put into designing and making the 4 discs. I will immerse myself in them till the weekend and will email in more detail then. thanks once again. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2037 Registered: 01-2005 |
Kev, I would say that musicOHM and Pop Maters have quiet the differing opinions from Quietus, Clash and Fact Magazine regarding High Violet! At least High Violet made the list (ranked #33) in Clash. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 987 Registered: 10-2008 |
pitchforks "honorable mentions" - albums of the year to follow thursday,friday http://pitchfork.com/features/staff-list s/7894-albums-of-the-year-2010-honorable -mention/ michael - the national's album is almost a guilty pleasure for me. i shouldnt really like them, but i think this album is a great listen from start to finish. i used to lump them in with arcade fire, another guilty pleasure for me, but i think with this album they have blown them out the water. the critics dont seem to agree though. i would bet good money on arcade fire being the pazz and jop album of the year, or at least being top 3. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 988 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://features.metacritic.com/features/ 2010/music-critic-top-ten-lists-best-of- 2010/?tag=supplementary-nav;article;1 | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 989 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://www.anydecentmusic.com/article/15 /Top-10-of-the-Top-10s.aspx | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 990 Registered: 10-2008 |
the nme http://www.rocklistmusic.co.uk/2010.htm | ||
| peter ward Member Username: Peter_ward Post Number: 133 Registered: 06-2005 |
Thanks for the list postings Kevin, have to revisit some of these albums that are polling high but didn't leave a mark at the time. Glad to see "Brothers" by Black Keys polling strongly, it's a modern classic! Probably played it and "High Violet" most over the year but there's been some strong late releases too. Looking forward to next year already as I heard a track from the new PJ Harvey on the radio last night, didn't get the title but it dsounded fantastic, think it's a February release. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 991 Registered: 10-2008 |
peter, check the Song of the day December thread, on 2nd december i posted a clip of a song from the new pj harvey album. | ||
| peter ward Member Username: Peter_ward Post Number: 136 Registered: 06-2005 |
Found it Kevin, that's the track, it's different for Polly but sounds excellent, bring on the album. I don't know the sample at all as I've always held an aversion to reggae and found any of the genre I've been exposed to vaguely annoying to be honest. I'm sure there's a Trojan compilation or somesuch that's a good starting point but I've never been arsed checking, any pointers to something that will turn ears and is not an expensive boxset?! | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 992 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://pitchfork.com/features/staff-list s/7893-the-top-50-albums-of-2010/1/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 993 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://www.factmag.com/2010/12/15/40-bes t-reissues-of-2010/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 994 Registered: 10-2008 |
peter, i always think trojans 2 cd album "punky reggae party" is a good intro for people to get into reggae. it covers my favourite period, usually referred to as "roots", you may already know it was compiled by don letts and comprises all the favourites of the london punk crowd that he dj-ed for. play.com have a good offer but its on backorder http://www.play.com/Music/CD/4-/2433216/ Punky-Reggae-Party/Product.html?searchst ring=punky+reggae+party&searchtype=allpr oducts&searchsource=0&urlrefer=search ebay have a few good offers http://shop.ebay.co.uk/?_from=R40&_trksi d=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=punky+reggae+par ty&_sacat=See-All-Categories Disc 1 Milk And Honey (Lizzard) White Belly Rat (Lee 'Scratch' Perry) Up Park Camp (John Holt) Mr Cop (Gregory Isaacs) Natural Mystic (Bob Marley & The Wailers) Cool Rasta (The Heptones) Sons Of Slaves (Junior Delgado) Key Of Keys (Michael Rose) Rockers (Glen Washington) Heavy Manners (Prince Far I) African Dub (The Silvertones) Three Piece Suit And Thing (Trinity) Uptown Top Ranking (Althea & Donna) Hand Cuff (Gregory Isaacs) Tell The Youths The Truth (Jimmy Riley) Danger In Your Eyes (The Mighty Diamonds) City Too Hot (Lee 'Scratch' Perry) I Love Marijuana (Linval Thompson) Slum (Gregory Isaacs' All Stars) Disc 2 Man Next Door (Dennis Brown) Marcus Say (Jah Woosh) The People Got To Know (Sugar Minott) Barber Saloon (Mikey Dread) Cross OVer (Junior Murvin) Lightnin And Thunder (Bim Sherman) You're No Good (Jammy's) (Ken Boothe) Kingston 12 Tuffie (The Morwells) Born Free (Black Uhru) (Michael Rose) Pope Paul Dead And Gone (Trinity) Liquid Horns (Vin Gordon & The Corner Shots) My Mission Is Impossible (The Viceroys) Babylon Wrong (Ashanti Waugh) Neckodeemus (The Congos) The Raiders (Junior Delgado) Rob And Gone (Barrington Levy) Throne Of Blood (Prince Jammy) MR C.I.D. (Barry Brown) Money In My Pocket (Dennis Brown) (Prince Mohammed) | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 1538 Registered: 08-2006 |
Hey, Peter: I'm certainly not the reggae expert here, and this violates your "no expensive box set" rule, but I've always loved the four-CD comp "Tougher Than Tough: The Story of Jamaican Music." It's an amazing overview of the music, from ska to reggae, and it's anything but annoying. I'd also get "Two Sevens Clash" by Culture. I can't imagine any music fan not digging it. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 995 Registered: 10-2008 |
this is more like it!! of the top 12 the only two i dont own are no's 3 and 5. never heard of no5, but no 3's on my wish list. dont diagree with much of it, but no 15 would be top 5 for me. http://www.residentadvisor.net/feature.a spx?1264 | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 996 Registered: 10-2008 |
simon reynolds take http://www.blissout.blogspot.com/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 997 Registered: 10-2008 |
from wire magazine 1. actress - splazsh (which with weird timing i was midway through listening to when i read this list) 2. oneohtrix point never - returnal 3. swans - my father will guide me.. 4. joanna newsome - have one on me 5. catherine christer hennix - the electric harpsichord 6. rangers - suburban tours 7. ariel pinks haunted graffiti - before today 8. john tillbury & sebastian lexer - lost daylight 9. keith fullerton whitman - disenguity/disengenousness 10. kevin drumm - necro acoustic | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 998 Registered: 10-2008 |
the guardian http://www.guardian.co.uk/music | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 999 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entert ainment/music/features/peer-to-peer-the- stars-albums-of-the-year-2162301.html | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1000 Registered: 10-2008 |
rough trade's list - really good to see caribou at no1, will be in my top 5 electronica when i get round to it. ALBUMS OF THE YEAR (by Rough Trade) 1. Caribou - Swim 2. Gil Scott-Heron - I'm New Here 3. These New Puritans - Hidden 4. Caitlin Rose - Own Side Now 5. Phosphorescent - Here's To Taking It Easy 6. Darkstar - North 7. Charlotte Gainsbourg - IRM 8. Gold Panda - Lucky Shiner 9. Wild Nothing - Gemini 10. Tame Impala - Innerspeaker 11. Broken Bells - Broken Bells 12. Avi Buffalo - Avi Buffalo 13. The National - High Violet 14. Emeralds - Does It Look Like I'm Here? 15. Beach House - Teen Dream 16. Voice Of The Seven Thunders - Voice Of The Seven Thunders 17. Perfume Genius - Learning 18. Crocodiles - Sleep Forever 19. The Black Keys - Brothers 20. The Morning Benders - Big Echo 21. Arcade Fire - The Suburbs 22. Salem - King Night 23. Brian Eno - Small Craft On A Milk Sea 24. Dylan Leblanc - Paupers Field 25. Joanna Newson - Have One On Me 26. Matthew Dear - Black City 27. Warpaint - The Fool 28. Liars - Sisterworld 29. LCD Soundsystem - This Is Happening 30. John Grant - Queen Of Denmark 31. Konono No 1 - Assume Crash Position 32. Smoke Fairies - Through Low Light And Trees 33. Surfer Blood - Astro Coast 34. Villagers - Becoming A Jackal 35. Crystal Castles - Crystal Castles 36. Mount Kimbie - Crooks And Lovers 37. Flying Lotus - Cosmogramma 38. Best Coast - Crazy For You 39. PVT - Church With No Magic 40. Laura Marling - I Speak Because I Can 41. Vampire Weekend - Contra 42. Edwyn Collins - Losing Sleep 43. Yeasayer - Odd Blood 44. Midlake - The Courage Of Others 45. The Soft Pack - The Soft Pack 46. Sleigh Bells - Treats 47. O Children - O Children 48. Glasser - Ring 49. Zola Jesus - Stridulum 2 50. Holly Miranda - The Magician's Private Library 51. Sea Of Bees - Songs For The Ravens 52. JJ - No3 53. Pantha Du Prince - Black Noise 54. Twin Shadow - Forget 55. Gonjasufi - A Sufi And A Killer 56. Bear In Heaven - Beast Rest Forth Mouth 57. Ariel Pink's Haunted Graffiti - Before Today 58. Cours Lapin - Cours Lapin 59. Darwin Deez - Darwin Deez 60. School Of Seven Bells - Disconnect From Desire 61. Beach Fossils - Beach Fossils 62. Shit Robot - From The Cradle To The Rave 63. Jonsi - Go 64. Dum Dum Girls - I Will Be 65. Belle And Sebastian - Belle And Sebastian Write About Love 66. Chilly Gonzales - Ivory Tower 67. Connan Mokasin - Please Turn Me Into The Snat 68. Holy Fuck - Latin 69. The School - Loveless Unbeliever 70. Tobacco - Maniac Meat 71. Dios - We Are Dios 72. Allo Darlin' - Allo Darlin' 73. Swans - My Father Will Guide Me Up A Rope To The Sky 74. Male Bonding - Nothing Hurts 75. El Guincho - Pop Negro 76. Oneohtrix Point Never - Returnal 77. Kort (Kurt Wagner And Cortney Tidwell) - Invariable Heartache 78. Solar Bears - She Was Coloured In 79. Free Energy - Stuck On Nothing 80. Sufjan Stevens - The Age Of Adz 81. Kings Go Forth - The Outsiders Are Back 82. Grinderman - Grinderman 2 83. Dan Michaelson And The Coastguards - Shakes 84. Stornoway - Beachcomber's Windowsill 85. Tamaryn - The Waves 86. The Tallest Man On Earth - The Wild Hunt 87. Four Tet - There Is Love In You 88. Magic Kids - Memphis 89. Marina And The Diamonds - Family Jewels 90. Mystery Jets - Serotonin 91. Black Angels - Phosphene Dream 92. Danger Mouse And Sparklehorse - Dark Night Of The Soul 93. Fool's Gold - Fool's Gold 94. Frankie Rose And The Outs - Frankie Rose And The Outs 95. Aloe Blacc - Good Things 96. Drums Of Death - Generation Hexed 97. Am - Future Sons And Daughters 98. Field Music - Field Music (Measure) 99. Hot Chip - One Life Stand 100. Time And Spacemachine - Set Phazer To Stun | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1001 Registered: 10-2008 |
rolling stone and spin Rolling Stone Top 30 of 2010 1. Kanye West, My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy 2. The Black Keys, Brothers 3. Elton John and Leon Russell, The Union 4. Arcade Fire, The Suburbs 5. Jamey Johnson, The Guitar Song 6. Vampire Weekend, Contra 7. Drake, Thank Me Later 8. Robert Plant, Band of Joy 9. Eminem, Recovery 10. LCD Soundsystem, This Is Happening 11. The Dead Weather, Sea of Cowards 12. John Mellencamp, No Better Than This 13. Taylor Swift, Speak Now 14. Robyn, Body Talk 15. The National, High Violet 16. Kid Rock, Born Free 17. Beach House, Teen Dream 18. Kings of Leon, Come Around Sundown 19. M.I.A., Maya 20. Neil Young, Le Noise 21. Big Boi, Sir Lucious Left Foot: The Son of Chico Dusty /// 22. Spoon, Transference 23. Elizabeth Cook, Welder 24. Maximum Balloon, Maximum Balloon 25. Superchunk, Majesty Shredding 26. Yeasayer, Odd Blood 27. Peter Wolf, Midnight Souvenirs 28. My Chemical Romance, Danger Days: The True Lives of the Fabulous Killjoys 29. The Roots, How I Got Over 30. Rick Ross, Teflon Don Spin Top 40 of 2010 01 Kanye West- My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy 02 Deerhunter - Halcyon Digest 03 Arcade Fire - The Suburbs 04 LCD Soundsystem - This Is Happening 05 Jamey Johnson - The Guitar Song 06 Janelle Monae - The Archandroid 07 Grinderman - Grinderman 2 08 M.I.A. - Maya 09 Kid Cudi - Man On The Moon II: The Legend Of Mr. Rager 10 Robyn - Body Talk Pt. 1 11 Vampire Weekend - Contra 12 Yeasayer - Odd Blood 13 Big Boi - Sir Lucious Left Foot: The Song Of Chico Dusty 14 Best Coast - Crazy For You 15 Titus Andronicus - The Monitor 16 Drake - Thank Me Later 17 Beach House - Team Dream 18 Superchunk - Majesty Shredding 19 No Age - Everything In Between 20 MGMT - Congratulations 21 Crystal Castles - Crystal Castles 22 Cee Lo Green - The Lady Killer 23 Gorillaz - Plastic Beach 24 Wavves - King Of The Beach 25 of Montreal - False Priest 26 The National - High Violet 27 Glasser - Ring 28 Neil Young - Le Noise 29 Sleigh Bells - Treats 30 The Black Keys - Brothers 31 Spoon - Transference 32 Big K.R.I.T. - K.R.I.T. Wuz Here 33 Ted Leo And The Pharmacists - The Brutalist Bricks 34 Against Me! - White Crosses 35 Robert Plant - Band Of Joy 36 The Gaslight Anthem - American Slang 37 The Walkmen - Lison 38 Eminem - Recovery 39 Caribou - Swim 40 Teenage Fanclub - Shadows | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1002 Registered: 10-2008 |
drowned in sound Drowned in Sound's Favourite Albums of 2010: Top Ten 1) Emeralds Does It Look Like I’m Here? 2) The National High Violet 3) Deftones Diamond Eyes 4) Perfume Genius Learning 5) The Knife Tomorrow, In a Year 6) These New Puritans Hidden 7) Shearwater The Golden Archipelago 8) Yeasayer Odd Blood 9) LCD Soundsystem This Is Happening 10) Sufjan Stevens Age of Adz | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1003 Registered: 10-2008 |
looks like kanye rules this year. havent heard even a note from it! http://pitchfork.com/features/staff-list s/7893-the-top-50-albums-of-2010/4/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1004 Registered: 10-2008 |
tiny mix tapes http://www.tinymixtapes.com/features/201 0-favorite-50-albums-2010 | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 252 Registered: 02-2005 |
Skulldisco wrote: "Guy, spookily in tandem with this thread and Michael B's post above, the package you sent me arrived today..." Well, a gentleman must have his hobbies. ;o) You're very welcome. I get a kick out of the photoshop stuff and I assemble artwork for almost every custom edition type disc I make. Whenever I download a show from Dimeadozen I do graphics (if it's something I expect to listen to more than once). I typically post them on Dime although very few people seem to go back to those pages and get them... there's no dialogue over there. I'll be curious to hear what you think when you get a chance to listen to that stuff (I'm having trouble remembering exactly what I sent at the mo'). | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 253 Registered: 02-2005 |
Skulldisco: I sent you my "Dread Guy" disc, right? I did that a couple years ago and I must say, I've gotten many a thumbs-up for that one. When I finished the thing it was a few seconds too long, so I tightened-up the mix into the closing vocal salutation and it clocked-in at 79:55. The planets were in alignment. I used to make cassettes of reggae singles, but had never done a CDR. I was leaning towards doing a vocal harmony group collection when I had a Homer Simpson moment, “Duh! Do a free-flowing mix of vocals, dub versions, toasters and melodica instrumentals. That’s what reggae is about.” I knew that I wanted to start the disc with that Mikey Dread single because it starts with that great vocal incantation. I only had the three Armageddon Time tracks and the Lloyd Parks > Glen Brown > Big Youth mixes in mind when I started. I recognized that the Sylford Walker and Welton Irie tracks used the same ‘Slaving’ riddim as I was searching for material so I worked those five together one evening. The Horace Andy > Sister Bloss/Echo General sequence was also something I recognized as I was doing this thing… I don’t have an encyclopedic knowledge of reggae riddims. So I worked on individual vocal/version mixes and built-up the material over the course of a few beer-drinking nights and then did a couple test burn sequences. There was quite a bit of tweaking; output levels, edits at the fades, etc. I keep meaning to do a Volume 2, but haven’t come up with a place to start. A friend sent me links to a couple reggae sites that catalogue producer’s riddims, so that will be a big help if I ever do. | ||
| peter ward Member Username: Peter_ward Post Number: 140 Registered: 06-2005 |
Kevin/Rob, took a punt on Punky Reggae Party and Culture and hoping for a mellow Christmas. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1007 Registered: 10-2008 |
simon reynolds lists http://blissout.blogspot.com/2010/12/10- for-2010-rangers-suburban-tours.html | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 1540 Registered: 08-2006 |
Hey, Peter, what does that mean, to "take a punt" on something? Does it mean to take a chance - like, what the hell, I'll do it? In the US, punting usually means giving up, or taking a pass on something, or throwing up your hands, related to the punt in American football, which is kind of a sign of futility. Just curious - I've heard the term the way you used it, but never knew just what it meant. If taking a punt on Culture means you bought "Two Sevens Clash," I hope you love it. I think I'll play it now... | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2041 Registered: 01-2005 |
Leave it to Rolling Stone for including Taylor Swift at #13. Sometimes I wonder why I still keep my subscription to RS going with that curious selection. | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 1981 Registered: 09-2006 |
Not only is it great to see Gil Scott-Heron on the RT list, but also that he placed so high! Michael, I gave up reading RS quite awhile ago, but I actually might not have a beef with the selection you mention. Xgau helped me warm up to her last album, and I'm at the very least interested in hearing her new one. It probably helps if you have a taste for chewy pop. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2042 Registered: 01-2005 |
Allen, While I don't mind some chewy pop out of Nashville (I've got a few Shania Twain albums), it's Ms. Swifts generic singing voice that doesn't peak my interest enough to buy any of her albums. Give me Elizabeth Cook, Tift Merritt or Canadians like Kathleen Edwards and Sarah Harmer and I'm there. | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 1983 Registered: 09-2006 |
Though I wouldn't put her voice up with the others you mention, I do think it's got plenty of its own personality. Update, as I'm listening to a few tracks from her new one as we speak: what feels a little generic on this one (at first listen) is the subject matter. "Innocent," her olive branch to Kanye, is a lovely, wise stroke, though. | ||
| Mark Leydon Member Username: Mark_leydon Post Number: 319 Registered: 05-2005 |
Hey Rob - 'taking a punt' on something means taking a gamble on it. Comes from the word 'punt' which is vernacular in these parts for betting. It's a common expression in Aus/NZ - and I think also in the UK and Ireland (maybe Padraig can confirm). Its also the derivation of the word 'punters' to describe concert-goers. | ||
| peter ward Member Username: Peter_ward Post Number: 141 Registered: 06-2005 |
Hi Rob, they're new interpretations on me, I meant punt is as outlined by Mark above, to take a gamble, as derived from punters...common expressions would be.. "The Punters are always right" "Punters vote with their feet" etc | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1008 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://pitchfork.com/features/guest-list s/7891-guest-list-best-of-2010/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1009 Registered: 10-2008 |
from allmusic, the link below contains lists from a selection of ther writers http://blog.allmusic.com/2010/12/15/allm usic-loves-2010/ also from allmusic, the electronic album chart below contains most of the albums i spent so much time listening to this year. its been a great year for electronic music, even better than 2008. Actress – Splazsh Arp – The Soft Wave Caribou – Swim Deadbeat – Radio Rothko Matthew Dear – Black City DJ Roc – The Crack Capone Emeralds – Does It Look Like I’m Here? Thomas Fehlmann – Gute Luft Fluxion – Perfused Flying Lotus – Cosmogramma Four Tet – There Is Love in You Girl Talk – All Day Ikonika – Contact, Love, Want, Have Kode9 – DJ-Kicks Lindstrřm & Christabelle – Real Life Is No Cool Michael Mayer – Immer 3 Mount Kimbie – Crooks & Lovers Optimo – Fabric 52 Pantha du Prince – Black Noise Ewan Pearson – We Are Proud of Our Choices Scuba – Sub:Stance Shed – The Traveler Skream – Outside the Box Teengirl Fantasy – 7AM Christopher Willits – Tiger Flower Circle Sun Various Artists – Ninja Tune XX, Vol. 1 | ||
| peter ward Member Username: Peter_ward Post Number: 143 Registered: 06-2005 |
I've listened to about six of those albums Kevin, dipped my toe in electronica 2010, one I would add to the list is the debut by Walls which was very lazer guided melodies in a good way, if you like that kind of thing. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1010 Registered: 10-2008 |
peter, you've just reminded me to play that album by walls. i'm listening to it now at work, sounds pretty blissed out and more melodic than i had envisaged. wasnt it album of the year somewhere? maybe fact magazine? | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1012 Registered: 10-2008 |
the albums that i played and enjoyed most this year. caribou - swim actress - splazsh mount kimbie - crooks and lovers scuba - triangulation darkstar - north four tet - there is love in you flying lotus - cosmogramma forest swords - dagger paths twin shadow - forget lcd soundsystem - this is happening and the 10 reissues/comps that i played and enjoyed most this year various - night slug allstars scientist - scientist launches dubstep into outer space the uniques - absolutely rocksteady lee scratch perry - sound system scratch lightnin hopkins - his blues anthony "shake" shakir - frictionalism iggy and the stooges - raw power rolling stones - exile on main street david bowie - station to station virgo - virgo rem - fables of the reconstruction | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3743 Registered: 05-2005 |
This was not as great a year for albums, I thought, as many recent years. Hence, three EPs in my top four. I love EPs though, and am delighted to see them making a resurgence! 1 Band Of Horses – Infinite Arms 2 Girls – Broken Dreams Club EP 3 Georgia Fair – Times Fly EP 4 Boy & Bear – With Emperor Antarctica EP 5 Cabins – Bright Victory 6 The Gaslight Anthem – American Slang 7 Dan Kelly – Dan Kelly’s Dream 8 The Posies – Blood/Candy 9 The National – High Violet 10 Laura Marling – I Speak Because I Can 11 Cathal Coughlan – Rancho Tetrahedron 12 Gorillaz – Plastic Beach 13 The Duke & The King – Long Live The Duke & The King 14 Paul Weller – Wake Up The Nation 15 Gareth Liddiard – Strange Tourist 16 Tame Impala – Innerspeaker 17 JJ – No 3 18 Villagers – Becoming A Jackal 19 Glenn Richards – Glimjack 20 Dave Couse – Alone Walk 21 Best Coast – Crazy For You 22 Johnny Cash – American VI: Ain't No Grave 23 Jason Walker – Ceiling Sun Letters 24 Surfer Blood – Astro Coast 25 Free Energy – Stuck On Nothing 26 The Harvest Ministers – Strange Love Letter 27 The John Steel Singers – Tangalooma 28 Holly Miranda – The Magician’s Private Library 29 Halfway – An Outpost Of Promise 30 Robert Plant – Band Of Joy | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3749 Registered: 05-2005 |
Of course I forgot something - Frightened Rabbit. Updated list: Records of the year 2010 1 Band Of Horses – Infinite Arms 2 Frightened Rabbit – The Winter of Mixed Drinks 3 Girls – Broken Dreams Club EP 4 Georgia Fair – Times Fly EP 5 Boy & Bear – With Emperor Antarctica EP 6 Cabins – Bright Victory 7 The Gaslight Anthem – American Slang 8 Dan Kelly – Dan Kelly’s Dream 9 The Posies – Blood/Candy 10 The National – High Violet 11 Laura Marling – I Speak Because I Can 12 Cathal Coughlan – Rancho Tetrahedron 13 Gorillaz – Plastic Beach 14 The Duke & The King – Long Live The Duke & The King 15 Paul Weller – Wake Up The Nation 16 Gareth Liddiard – Strange Tourist 17 Tame Impala – Innerspeaker 18 JJ – No 3 19 Villagers – Becoming A Jackal 20 Glenn Richards – Glimjack 21 Dave Couse – Alone Walk 22 Best Coast – Crazy For You 23 Johnny Cash – American VI: Ain't No Grave 24 Jason Walker – Ceiling Sun Letters 25 Surfer Blood – Astro Coast 26 Free Energy – Stuck On Nothing 27 The Harvest Ministers – Strange Love Letter 28 The John Steel Singers – Tangalooma 29 Holly Miranda – The Magician’s Private Library 30 Halfway – An Outpost Of Promise | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3757 Registered: 05-2005 |
Just realised I also forgot to include Johnny Ray's Downtown by Perry Keyes too. Let's call it 16 and move everything else down one. Sorry Halfway. At least I'm replacing one Australian with another though. | ||
| andreas Member Username: Andreas Post Number: 842 Registered: 04-2006 |
o.k. 2010 fades away and no new album will be bought today. therefore it's time for a summary. first i have to say that this year i just bought only a few new albums. all the year round i enjoyed yeasayer's odd blood most. so i would say that this album is the winner. for sure there were a few more albums which i liked. without ranking i would count in: dustin wong - infinite love can't put it in the correct english words, so please read here: http://thequietus.com/articles/05091-dus tin-wong-infinite-love-review james blackshaw - all is falling also hard to describe, therefore i give you this link: http://drownedinsound.com/releases/15607 /reviews/4140788 junip - fields jose gonzales' band. airy and uplifting. mount kimbie - crooks & lovers they call it post dubstep, i call it a more or less marvellous minimalistic piece of electronic music. richard thompson - dream attic first richard thompson album i really liked since years. i have the double disc (electric/acoustic). i prefer the electric one. gunn-truscinski duo - sand city strange. if it comes to this kind of music i am always lost of words: http://boomkat.com/vinyl/353894-gunn-tru scinski-duo-sand-city darkstar - north another so called post dubstep album. but isn't that just pure pop? caribou - swim remixes swim is great, for sure, but i like that remix album much more. fabulous, marvellous. great! la vampires meets zola jesus - s/t this six song ep is like a combination of colourbox/mark stewart/maffia dub sound and a dark wave sound. bob dylan - in concert brandeis university 1963 i bought the widmark demos and got this 7 song live recording for free. it's an unreleased concert and it is great and much more enyoable than the widmark demos double cd. 47 early dylan songs in a row are fantastic but can also be exhausting. motorpsycho - heavy metal fruit like always. a trip! jenny wilson - hardships! released in germany in 2010, so i can count in this album too. pop? songwriter? idiosyncratic! i am kloot - sky at night not an album i am crazy about, but when i listen to it i ever fall in love with this discreet but charming music. david sylvian - sleepwalkers not a real new album. just a collection of music which he did together with others. fantastic music. joanna newsom - have one on me triple album in a box. like from the last century. the music thereon is brilliant. but i know that most of you do not like her voice. kammerflimmer kollektief - wildling magic, minimalistic, krautrock, freejazz, electronics, poetic, simply beautiful. music for the infinity. hope i didn't forgot any album out there worth to mention. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2051 Registered: 01-2005 |
I just gave my newly arrived Caribou - Swim CD it's first spin. It will be in my top album list for 2010. Next up to listen to is Vampire Weekend - Contra, Robert Plant - Joy, Sleigh Bells - Treats, and Mumford & Sons - Sight No More, all of them arrived just yesterday. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1026 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://pitchfork.com/features/staff-list s/7892-2010-pitchfork-readers-poll/ | ||
| David Gagen Member Username: David_g Post Number: 343 Registered: 02-2007 |
My top 5 albums for the year. The top 1 by a mile! 1.Stornoway - Beachcomber’s Windowsill 2.Band of Horses- Infinite Arms 3.Robert Plant - Band of Joy 4.Grinderman - Grinderman 2 5.The National - Violet | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1030 Registered: 10-2008 |
http://onethirtybpm.com/features/the-top -50-albums-of-2010/ | ||
| andreas Member Username: Andreas Post Number: 849 Registered: 04-2006 |
i have to add this gem ''Emeralds - Does It Look Like I'm Here?'' to my list. absolutely mindblowing electronics. one of the 2010 records, definetely. discovered late, but not too late. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1050 Registered: 10-2008 |
pazz and jop albums of the year revealed today. kanye wins by a landslide, i've still never heard one note from it. in the singles list, rap cleans up. there isnt a rock song till number 8 (aerial pink), the first 7 places dominated by kanye and other rap artists http://www.villagevoice.com/pazznjop/alb ums/2010/ http://www.villagevoice.com/pazznjop/sin gles/2010/ | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1051 Registered: 10-2008 |
the results from pazz and jop, combined with this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-12209 143 on the validity of albums got me thinking, is the album on its death bed? the pazz and jop poll must be the most comprehensive poll going, and probably is the most accurate barometer of what are the best albums of any given year, albeit voted by critics. this years poll throws up a bunch of albums that are mostly underwhelming and i cant think many will be in "albums of the decade" lists, assuming likely candidates will come from the top30 listed. the bbc article makes me wonder if artists will still see the album as a valid vehicle for getting their music out there in years to come. the paucity of great albums in the recent years makes me think a lot of them are just going through the motions and they place more store in gigging, which is where the money seems to be made now. then again, will music fans go and see a band that dont make albums, probably not? | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 1546 Registered: 08-2006 |
Kev, here's Christgau's take on the subject. http://bnreview.barnesandnoble.com/t5/Ro ck-Roll/Live-Albums/ba-p/4025 He argues the opposite, but more or less agrees with you that gigging's where the money is (and where it's always been, really, unless you're Michael Jackson). It took me a while to get buying and listening to new music this year but by the time I got up a head of steam I was pretty happy with the year over all. Though I'll say there wasn't a single record that stood out as my clear fave this year (LCD came close). Just 25-30 CDs I'm glad to own and will probably play down the road when the mood strikes. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1054 Registered: 10-2008 |
rob, i hope he's right and the album doesnt die. i cant agree with him that this has been a good year, certainly not going by what is reflected in the pazz and jop, and his own list, and i am sceptical about his claim that he'll be listening to a lot of these albums 5 or 10 years down the line. although he seems a big hip hop fan(i'm not), so he can enjoy these albums in 5 or 10 years time and i'll enjoy the electronica stuff that was omitted from his, and the pazz and jop list. on the subject of this (self appointed?) dean, i find my eyes just glaze over when reading his stuff, he bores the pants off me! maybe he is the american version of john peel? ie instrumental in shaping the listening habits of millions, but i wasnt aware of him until 10 or so years ago whereas i had heard of lester bangs and david fricke. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2564 Registered: 03-2005 |
I restrained myself for a whole day. I think the chances of Kanye West's current album being the best of 2010 when folks look back in, say, 2020 are about equal to the chances of my finding a one million dollar bill in my mail when I come home from work today. Why is this guy talking about major labels? Major labels have been completely past-tense for well over a decade now, except perhaps in small markets like Australia. The old music business is not fading; it's gone. Warners/Elektra/Atlantic have a building in Burbank which I drive by every week. On the side of this building is a huge billboard mural announcing the Eric Clapton Guitar Festival (or something like that). With an event date in 2010. That says it all. The majors sell Vocorder-ized crap to teenyboppers and to old farts the 18th version of their favorite records from the '60s and '70s. Concerning albums, lately I've been thinking that 5 or 6 song EPs might serve some of the less prolific and more committed artists better than albums. They can come out more frequently. They're long enough to get the listener into the artist's vibe but they're short enough to hold the listener's attention. And, best of all, there can be another one released much sooner than we're used to with equally good material. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2126 Registered: 10-2004 |
I don't know, Kanye is pretty huge. It's easy for us to dismiss him because we live in our little bubble of tasteful, independent-ish music and his music and the music of his peers has no bearing on our lives. But for everyone else, he is an era-defining event, much like Taylor Swift or Katy Perry or Lady Ga Ga, etc... So, Kanye's album being considered for best of 2010 ten years from now will depend largely on who you're asking. What is kind of interesting to me, though, is to look back over the last decade, particularly the earlier part, and examine whether certain indie artists who were huge then still hold up today, and ponder whether those who don't might have any kind of resurgence 10 years later. But that's for another thread. |