| Author | Message | ||
     Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3931 Registered: 05-2005 |
I think the discussion elsewhere here warrants this thread. 1 The Boatman's Call 2 The Good Son 3 Kicking Against the Pricks 4 No More Shall We Part 5 Abattoir Blues/The Lyre of Orpheus | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3932 Registered: 05-2005 |
Murder Ballads was the one where I thought "he's done this before". I was relieved when The Boatman's Call came out 13 months later and proved he still had the ability to do something different, and stunning. I was very surprised when the Classic Australian Albums series on SBS TV choose Murder Ballads over any other Nick Cave record. I just assumed they chose it because it meant they could interview Kylie Minogue and boost their audience figures. I like Murder Ballads a lot more now than I did initially, but it's not a patch on any of those above. | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1066 Registered: 08-2004 |
1. Abatoir/Lyre 2. Kicking Against The Pricks 3. The Firstborn Is Dead 4. The Boatman's Call 5. Dig! Lazarus Dig! I think AB/LOO were great sounding & complemented each other nicely. Certainly have never found them heavy going unlike Murder Ballads & to an extent No More Shall We Part. You have the kind of throwaway punkish numbers with black humour which are fun on AB & the stunning 'Hiding All Away' with it's vocal fuck-ups celebrated. Then the uplifting & even anthemic songs to close LOO particularly 'Carry Me' & 'Oh Children'. Who could imagine that Blixa Bargeld leaving would bring a harder rocking sound to the band. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1271 Registered: 10-2008 |
1. your funeral my trial 2. kicking against the pricks 3. abatoir/lyre 4. let love in 5. tender prey must admit im also loving the murder ballads, though i appreciate that maybe coming to it late is a good thing, rather than the rest of you hearing it when it was released and thinking it wasnt what the world is waiting for!! the version of stagger lee is astonishing. the duets with pj harvey and kylie are great too. and like i never tire of saying, the bad seeds are just incredible, but they always are arent they? | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2216 Registered: 10-2004 |
1. From Her to Eternity 2. Tender Prey 3. Your Funeral 4. The Firstborn is Dead 5. The Good Son For me, Nick Cave's artistic/creative peak is From Her to Eternity. Nothing he's done before or since can quite match the stark, menacing brilliance of that record. And yet, I'm probably the only one who will list it - perhaps most people prefer Cave when he's doing easy listening shmaltz or his cartoony John Finn's Wife pastiches, ie - when he's being "safe"? Tender Prey is also exceptionally good. I had trouble deciding which album to put in the number 5 slot. I could just as easily choose Let Love In or Henry's Dream, but the Good Son was the last album before Cave's schtick began to take over. | ||
| cosmo vitelli Member Username: Cosmo Post Number: 342 Registered: 05-2005 |
I'm with Jeff in that nothing compares to the first two albums impact wise, I like the 'easy listening schmaltz' too though 1. The Firstborn is Dead 2. From Her to Eternity 3. Abbatoir Blues 4. No More Shall We Part 5. Let Love In The Good Son could squeeze in there somewhere | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1272 Registered: 10-2008 |
i think its called variety :-) although, i am with jeff in that i prefer the menacing stuff to the "easy listening", although cave's easy listening is not the same as everybody elses idea - prefab sprout for example? | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1273 Registered: 10-2008 |
saint huck, red right hand, or mercy seat? cant decide which of these three classics is my all time favourite. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3939 Registered: 05-2005 |
Jeff, I'm sure you consider The Boatman's Call "easy listening shmaltz", but have you ever actually listened to the words? Easy listening it ain't. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1274 Registered: 10-2008 |
actually, i might have to reappraise let love in. having played it 3 times in the last few days it might be edging up my list to at least 2nd position. sounds to me like this is the cave album that covers all his musical guises, and crucially also has tunes aplenty. the bad seeds just nail it perfectly, a great line up at this point. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2183 Registered: 01-2005 |
1. The Boatman's Call 2. Tender Prey 3. Abatoir/Lyre 4. The Murder Ballads (Tender Prey on steroids, but I still like it). 5. The Good Son I still have yet to add Henry's Dream and Nocturma to my Nick collection. I also don't have the second Grinderman. My fist Nick Cave was a CD of Tender Prey in 1989. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2672 Registered: 03-2005 |
I can't weigh in on this because I don't have "From Her to Eternity," "Let Love In," "Murder Ballads," "Nocturna" or "Dig, Lazarus, Dig." I will stick up for Cave's "easy listening" numbers. I love "Foi Na Cruz" for example. I don't have the Grinderman records because I don't really think Cave's noisy numbers have been all that good since the breakup of the Birthday Party. The Bad Seeds really did turn into a hell of a band. Nonetheless, I saw Nick Cave once in Los Angeles in about 1988 or so. The show was unspeakably dull. I imagine they've improved considerably since then. That and "Henry's Dream" is what put me off Nick Cave & the Bad Seeds until somebody played "No More Shall We Part" to me in this past decade. Then I started buying a few things again. I still think he could profit from making fewer records but he's hardly the only person I'd say that about. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2217 Registered: 10-2004 |
Randy, have you actually heard From Her To Eternity? I disagree with you about Cave's noisier post-B-day Party numbers not being good. I'm not talking Grinderman, which I find dull and trite, but From Her to Eternity is the best thing the guy has ever done. I saw the Bad Seeds live in '94, and it was one of the most intense and cathartic shows I've ever seen. One of the very best shows I've ever been to, to date. Part of why I like Tender Prey so much is its nice balance between edgy and poppy. And I like *some* of the shmaltz, too - I love the loungey "Slowly Goes the Night." Michael - Murder Ballads is Tender Prey on steroids? I'd describe it as Tender Prey on reds! | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2186 Registered: 01-2005 |
Jeff, Maybe a mixture of the two? I was probably dwelling too much on the first two songs on the album, The Mercy Seat and Up Jumped The Devil. Did you know that Ultra Vivid Scene also had a song titled Mercy Seat? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aXF9DG9F Go | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2218 Registered: 10-2004 |
Well, I did a tally of the votes from the six people who voted, and here are the top 5 Nick Cave albums, ranked according to the folks around here. I factored in the number of votes each album received, but also where each album tended to rank in each list. (All the albums below Abatoir got three votes each, so I ranked them in order of where people tended to rank them in their lists). 1. Abatoir/Lyre 2. The Boatman's Call 3. Kicking Against The Pricks 4. The Firstborn is Dead 5. Tender Prey (and The Good Son would slot at #6; had the same number of votes as Tender Prey, but averaged lower rankings) Very interesting list, given that I don't even currently own the top 2. I'm just glad Tender Prey made it on there, even if it came in 5th. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1278 Registered: 10-2008 |
thanks for doing this jeff. i sometimes find that these things can be fluid, and over a 2 week period of intense bad seeds listening i find my order fluctuating ( i dont find this with all artists - eg my rem/smiths/clash/bowie/husker du/go-b's/new order fave albums are set in stone), and what i do know is that i have played let love in and murder ballads the most during this period. i reckon let love in is now my no1 choice, murder ballads still doesnt make top 5 although i think its really good, the reason i am playing it a lot is because its mostly new to me. i came across this feature from mojo, they asked their readers to rank cave's album. what they dont say is how many readers voted, it could be the thoughts of three people. results below, a few surprises but not the no1 (which i dont agree with) http://www.mojo4music.com/blog/2009/01/n ick_caves_greatest_albums.html | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1279 Registered: 10-2008 |
done some scouting about and found some more lists, some of which i have linked below. one thing i did detect while browsing through posts and lists was the surprising amount of support for murder ballads in particular, but also the good son as well. and while you could find support for any one of the albums from first to last, the overall concensus seems to be the first half dozen or so albums appear to be the most loved, and nocturna is the overwhelmingly unanimous clunker. http://www.ilxor.com/ILX/ThreadSelectedC ontrollerServlet?boardid=41&threadid=575 45 http://www.besteveralbums.com/thechart.p hp?b=1278#appearances http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/archiv e/index.php/t-218983.html | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2199 Registered: 01-2005 |
Did any on the recent remastered Nick Cave albums alter your rankings? I keep thinking back to when I got my double disc Talullah and was blown away by the uncovered bits that were buried on the previous versions. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3953 Registered: 05-2005 |
My take on my own great affection for The Good Son is that it was the first Nick Cave album I bought. I imagine it is the same for a lot of people my age. And didn't we all put Foi Na Cruz on mix tapes to show that special person that we were quite sensitive really? | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1070 Registered: 08-2004 |
I'm surprised you didn't know about Cave's love of Alex Harvey, Kevin. Most of the inaugral Boys Next Door live set were Alex Harvey songs. Also the cover of 'The Hammer Song' on KATP. I'd like to see an expanded version of KATP. It was initially conceived as a double album before being cut down in editing. The superb 'Rye Whisky' was on the boxset but I want more. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1297 Registered: 10-2008 |
Jerry, dont really know why, but I only have Cave/Bad Seeds records. I have absolutely nothing by either the Boys Next Door or The Birthday Party. That must be why it passed me by. Really should get some Birthday Party stuff! | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1071 Registered: 08-2004 |
Yeah I'm pretty much the same. Despite being a Bad Seeds completist. I've got some Birthday Party records locked away somewhere & I enjoy them when I listen to them. They just never really gripped me to keep them around for repeat plays. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2677 Registered: 03-2005 |
Birthday Party is certainly worth getting. Boys Next Door are strictly for the completist. Some of you will know that I usually favor an artist's earliest work but BND really were mostly undistinguished. It's amazing how much they transformed themselves when they became the Birthday Party. Kevin, I'll send you BND's best track; it's a melodramatic Cave ballad called "Shivers," highly suggestive of the work he'd do much later as a solo artist (which is also probably your least favorite Cave solo work). | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 1072 Registered: 08-2004 |
I believe 'Shivers' is a Rowland S. Howard song. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3961 Registered: 05-2005 |
It is a Roland S. Howard song. You beat me to the punch Jerry. He was 16 when he wrote it. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2678 Registered: 03-2005 |
I stand corrected. I was so unimpressed by the BND album that I never even looked at the jacket for things like songwriting credits. It's the only decent thing on there, IMO. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 3969 Registered: 05-2005 |
Howard reputedly got miffed about constantly being asked about a song he wrote when he was 16, and which was sung by Nick Cave in its most famous version. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1298 Registered: 10-2008 |
Thanks for sending Shiver Randy, its a beautiful song. And while its undoubtedly a RSH song, Windows Media Player says the composer is Nick Cave when I play it back. Maybe thats where you got the idea that Cave wrote it from, does Itunes display composers details too? Are you hinting that I might not like stuff like The Good Sun when you say that I might not like Cave doing this type of song? If so, you might be surprised to know that I have been caning that album for the last week or so, its great. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1299 Registered: 10-2008 |
That should be The Good Son obviously - its early!! | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1300 Registered: 10-2008 |
so where should i start with the birthday party? not that there's a massive selection! | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2220 Registered: 10-2004 |
Kevin - Start with the CD that compiles the Bad Seed and Mutiny EPs. Those were the last two things the Birthday Party did, and both show them at the peak of their powers. After that, go with Junkyard and Prayer's on Fire. I haven't heard the self-titled debut in years. It's less dissonant; not bad, but not as unhinged as later work. If you can track down the Best & Rarest comp, it's worthwhile, as it contains the Nick Cave-sung (as opposed to Rowland S. Howard-sung) version of "Ho-Ho," as well as the rarity "Scatterbrain," and the wall-of-noise dirge pop of "The Friend Catcher." | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1301 Registered: 10-2008 |
cheers jeff, i listened to some stuff online this morning, liked it, did some searching on amazon marketplace and got some great deals. "hits", which is a comp which takes the best from "junkyard" and "prayers on fire" and several tracks from the eps you mention i got for the princely sum of £1 (about 1.6 us dollars) - which is basically giving it away! "junkyard" and "prayers on fire" were a bit more expensive - £8 in total :-) so all in all i got the 3 cds for £9 (just over 14 us dollars) - cant be bad even if i find out that i dont like all of it. i have of course heard a lot of the stuff before over the years (release the bats,blast off, nick the stripper,big jesus trash can etc) but somehow never bought the albums, strange given what else i was buying in the early 80s. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2680 Registered: 03-2005 |
No, Kevin, I have no such excuse. I have the hard copy (on CD). I was just lazy. Although, in my feeble defense, the cheapie reissue I have on Mushroom/Warner Music doesn't even say who the songwriters are! Checking the limited information I see that the last four songs including "Shivers" date from 1979 and are engineered by Tony Cohen and produced by the band. I'm listening to all four of them now because it stands to reason that they are at least somewhat better than the other six tracks which date from 1978 and are produced by someone else altogether. "After a Fashion" is a fairly pedestrian song but you DO get a nice early noisy Rowland Howard guitar show. "Dive Position" is not making me want to leave the track on. The problem I have with Boys Next Door is that they're very "New Wave" in the worst sense of that word. Gimmicky but lacking a sense of danger or emotional depth. Cute. (Except "Shivers.") "I Mistake Myself" was probably a minor hit--or at least it sounds like it. It's at least moderately interesting. I'll send it to you and you'll see what I mean by the "New Wave" slam. That's interesting that you're going for "The Good Son." Well, actually, it's Jeff who zapped him for doing "easy listening" numbers. And, well, this old Hollies fan is totally okay with a lot of Cave's honking big ballads. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 2209 Registered: 01-2005 |
Kev is not the only one who was zero Birthday Party albums on vinyl, cassette or cd. One of these days I'll break the ice on BP and Split Enz. |