| Author | Message | ||
     Andrew Kerr Member Username: Andrew_k Post Number: 158 Registered: 04-2005 |
I was saddened to discover that this actress had been murdered recently. http://film.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/Guardian/0,,1942286,00.html She was in Hal Hartley's 'Trust' and 'An Unbelievable Truth'. I remember really liking these films at the time and Hal Hartley used Yo La Tengo on the soundtracks. Anyone know what Hal Hartley is up to these days? | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 84 Registered: 09-2006 |
IMDB says he's still making films, quite consistently. He's just fallen out of vogue - the last one on the list I caught was "Henry Fool" in 1997, and the critics' notices I've caught here and there since then haven't been kind at all. Definitely sad to hear about Ms. Shelley. Oh, Jack Palance passed away, too... | ||
| Allen Belz Member Username: Abpositive Post Number: 85 Registered: 09-2006 |
Just read the article...what a horrible way to go. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 937 Registered: 05-2005 |
What a nasty horrible bas*tard this guy who urdered her was. I really believe he should be hung for what he did, especially how he did it, sorry, but she was someone's daughter. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 844 Registered: 05-2005 |
That is truly shocking and disturbing. | ||
| Andrew Kerr Member Username: Andrew_k Post Number: 159 Registered: 04-2005 |
I actually met Jack Palance in the early '80s, when he was in Scotland to do a voice-over for a golf documentary (!). An impressive character with an imposing voice. Spence, Has something particularly nasty happened to you recently to cause this out-pouring of extremism (your other posting about rapists)? The world is a nasty place, but reacting in such a manner is not going to help it get any better. Just my opinion. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 940 Registered: 05-2005 |
Andrew, no! is the answer. Its just that this programme I watched disturbed me so and it happened that I was just posting on this board shortly after. And, when I saw a picture of Adrienne it made me angry that her life was taken so. So, I'll post my feelings, I slso think we have terrible problems in our society here esp within the UK, when murderers, rapists etc etc are let out way too early, I worry for my daughters, just my opinion too. We're all entitled to that. | ||
| andreas Member Username: Andreas Post Number: 319 Registered: 04-2006 |
when i think rational about i clearly say: no death penalty. but sometimes, when you are directly involved in things like we experienced last weekend -i was affronted without any reason by agressive stupids when i was with my son at the football/soccer game. it all went well because i didn't react like he awaited-, the thinking about sending the other to hell isn't unknown to me. and spence, we have the problems you mentioned here in germany too. your worries about yr. daughter are well known to me. in spite of everything: no death penalty. | ||
| Andrew Kerr Member Username: Andrew_k Post Number: 162 Registered: 04-2005 |
Sorry if this sounds like wishy washy liberal talk: it is important to make a distinction between the way that we feel in certain situations and the way that our society deems it acceptable to deal with those situations. So in a sense (as Andreas says) it is understandable (but paradoxical) to want to wring the life out of a another human being that has hurt my child for example, but ultimately not be in favour of the death penalty. I am not up to date with the current stories in the UK but would have a tendency to think that it is a un-balanced society that wishes to replace Trident, but cannot fund adequate therapy and rehab for offenders. Suppose it depends whether you believe people who have committed paedophile acts are capable of being integrated back into society. There is never going to be 100% accuracy in decisions regarding such cases. And yet we demand that from our social workers and medical health profession. I don't know what to add Spence: I just found your remarks a little 'Daily Mail' and knee-jerk. The kind of remarks that I fear can eventually lead to vigilante killings for example. | ||
| andreas Member Username: Andreas Post Number: 321 Registered: 04-2006 |
andrew, it didn't sound wishy washy. it sound how it should sound and couldn't put into the right words by myself. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 943 Registered: 05-2005 |
Sorry for having an opinion on something. To be perfectly honest Andrew, I do not wish to go on any deeper, however, I will say this much, that I do feel offended that you judge me by what I write on this msg board, without having an undertsanding of who I am, what I stand for and what my politics of life are about. As I say, I do not wish to discuss or debate, its not the place, but don't judge me, or anyone else for that matter, its not for you to judge, I think if anyone is an extremist at this point in time its yourself you need to look at, you are taking it to extremes talking about vigilante killings for example, take a chill pill my man, I don't go around shouting things like "anyone who harms my children is DEAD!" or anything, I don't have a heavy heart about this type of thing, they are comments on a msg board, the first was an airing of sadness I felt at watching the Panorama show, and the sadness I felt that this actress was brutally, I say brutally murdred, like you have your 'opinion' it was an 'opinion' on what I felt at the time, so don't feel free to judge people on comments/messgaes like this. Finally, I think this proves a point actually, my own fault really, that music and politics if you want to phrase it as such, don't mix on a msg board like this, I love music and life, and part of my life is the music of the GB's (hoping not too sound too sloppy!), so basically, from now on, not another word on any other subject other than music shall part form my keyboard's lips upon this msg board community, and especially if if I suffer comments comments like the above from Mr Kerr. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 944 Registered: 05-2005 |
Having just thought about it again, your comments are your comments, that I will accept, it is your opinion, its being judgemental about someone on this board you do not know that I think is pathetic. | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 105 Registered: 08-2006 |
Hey, Spence and Andrew: One of the things I've always enjoyed about this board - long before I started posting - is that people always disagreed gracefully. No one has the same opinions - about music, politics, social issues. That's what makes this makes space interesting, but writing about differences of opinion can be tricky, and I'd like to think this dispute boils down to perhaps some slightly over-forceful prose, which I don't think either of you fully embrace. Sorry if I'm putting words in your mouths, but I believe this to be the situation. Peace, y'all. Let's have a pint. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 948 Registered: 05-2005 |
Rob am all for what you say, the above is history for me, lets get back to it. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 1129 Registered: 05-2005 |
Spence, hope you dont carry out your threat not to post "on any other subject other than music" for two reasons. 1) Your opinions are valued on all subjects. 2) It will take you longer to reach the 1K posts - you're nearly there  PS I'm not taking sides here, its an emotive subject that Andrew and Spence are debating and both have valid points. | ||
| Andrew Kerr Member Username: Andrew_k Post Number: 163 Registered: 04-2005 |
OK I'll drink to that Rob. Peace. I'd love a pint actually. I'll agree with Spence that it is too easy to jump to conclusions about some else's views on a message board, based on a few remarks. But I was genuinely perturbed by those 2 comments and felt that that they should not pass unnoticed. Sorry for responding in a way that obviously has annoyed you Spence. Just to add that the 'vigilante killing' comes from a real event that my partner (distantly) experienced at the time of the one of the regular 'witch hunts' led by the gutter press in the UK. Anyway I should have known better, having recently 'fallen out' with a largely American based computer programming message board. I started questioning the constant quips about American world superiority and got into a ridiculous situation. Apparently I am a 'European Socialist' and this seems on a par with Al Quaida terrorists for some Americans. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 739 Registered: 03-2005 |
Don't drop off that board, Andrew! Too many Americans really need more contact with "European Socialists." | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 848 Registered: 05-2005 |
Just my opinion... Spence, I have to say that I found your pro-death penalty comments surprising too. As a father of a young daughter I can see where you are coming from, but I am still anti-death penalty. One of the reasons is that if the UK had the death penalty then the Birmingham Six, the Guildford Four and the Maguire Seven would all have been hanged in the 1970s instead of eventually being exonerated after spending 15+ years in jail for crimes they had nothing to do with. They were guilty of nothing other than being Irish in the wrong place at the wrong time.(I have no desire to start an Ireland vs England debate btw, I think it should be clear from previous posts that I find anti-Englishness in some Irish people appalling). I am also absolutely against the death penalty because I believe in proper punishment for crimes (that might be a bit Daily Mail for you Andrew!). If you execute someone their pain is then over; but if you lock murderers up for the rest of their lives you punish them every day. And punishment is why they are jailed. Rehabilitation is a product of that; but a lot of criminals can't or won't be rehabilitated. If they can't be rehabilitated they should just be locked up without remission until their sentence is over. (I know someone will come on and say "how do we know someone is rehabilitated?" Well, that's what people who work in the justice system get paid to do, it's not something I do.) And yes, I do think murderers should be locked up for life if there are no extenuating circumstances such as self-defence. ...Just my opinion | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 849 Registered: 05-2005 |
After the line "If you execute someone their pain is then over" I meant to add "but the pain suffered by the family of their victim goes on forever". If I may inject (but not lethally) a little humour here; I don't think Dostoevsky would have gotten famous enough to feature in a Go-Betweens lyric if he had written a book called Crime and Rehabilitation. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 850 Registered: 05-2005 |
I wonder if the brutal murder of Adrienne Shelly has led to a discussion of the rights and wrongs of the death penalty on any other msg boards? | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 106 Registered: 08-2006 |
Good question, Padraig. I'm guessing not. Vive la Go-Betweens board! | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 949 Registered: 05-2005 |
My final say on the above: "he should be shot!" was a phrase used by people that I heard many times whilst growing up. I don't really think that people would go out and shoot people, or demand that whoever they were talking about be shot. What I mentioned above, was pretty much in the same vein, and does not mean that I am pro-death penalty, I have never said that, and I am NOT pro-death penalty, this is what I am about, I can't really be bothered going on, here, let's say, I am suprised people lash out without actually bothering to know the people thay are lashing out against. The pints are lined up and they are pints of Guiness as they seem to be in trouble too... | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 854 Registered: 05-2005 |
I did not in any way mean to lash out Spence. I would be glad to get to know you if I lived in the English midlands! I hope we'll meet and drink Guinness one day in Brimingham or Dublin or Glasgow or Sydney or Rics bar in Brisbane (Long Island iced teas there though)! I've met a couple of people from this board (twice in fact in both cases) and enjoyed their company very much. I really would love for a bunch of us to get together somewhere sometime. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 952 Registered: 05-2005 |
Padraig can we make it Brisbane please! |