| Author | Message | ||
     skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1705 Registered: 10-2008 |
Pretty interesting and fun article in the new issue of The Word. The premise is take two albums from every year starting from 1967 going right up to 2000, one of which they declare to be overrated and the other underrated. Some interesting, if no doubt deliberately provocative choices - I'll list some that they have chosen below (O = Overrated, U = Underrated) 1967 - O - Forever Changes by Love. U - The 5000 Spirits Or The Layer of The Onion by The Incredible String Band 1977 - O - The Clash by The Clash U - 77 by Talking Heads 1979 - O - The Wall by Pink Floyd U - Secondhand Daylight by Magazine 1980 - O - Zenyatta Mondatta by The Police U - Waiting For A Miracle by The Comsat Angels 1982 - O - The Lexicon of Love by ABC U - Repercussion by The dB's 1984 - O - The Unforgettable Fire by U2 U - Swoon by Prefab Sprout 1991 - O - Loveless by My Bloody Valentine U - Bandwagonesque by Teenage Fanclub. 1999 - O - Play by Moby U - Suicaine Gratification by Paul Westerberg I always thought that 77 by Talking Heads was highy rated, not underrated, same for Bandwagonesque by Teenage Fanclub, but I suppose it'll get people talking! | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 4454 Registered: 05-2005 |
Most of those listed as underrated are not underrated by me (not that I've ever heard the Incredible String Band one though). And most of the ones listed as overrated are not so by me either! | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2395 Registered: 10-2004 |
I don't think Forever Changes is a good "overrated" album for 1967. At the time, it was rather underrated, and only garnered its critical and popular acclaim over the past couple of decades. My step-dad, who was a 17-year-old San Francisco hippie when Forever Changes came out, remembered Love only as a garage-y LA band who would occasionally come up to SF to play the odd show. They didn't really register much on his or his friends' radar at the time. Definitely under appreciated in their time. I also think a few of the pairings are silly because the genres are so far apart. Take 1979, for example. Obviously, every Pink Floyd album accept Piper is going to be considered overrated, no matter what you put it up against. It would seem more useful to me to list Secondhand Daylight with an album at least a little closer in terms of genre, like Unknown Pleasures, Join Hands, Entertainment!, or even something like Armed Forces. That would put Secondhand Daylight's underrated status in a different light, as in, you know, even up against these albums, it was still underrated. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1706 Registered: 10-2008 |
While I do like Forever Changes it probably is a bit overrated in my book. Loveless is an album that is probably easier to admire than to love. U2 and Moby are about as dreadful as any two albums I can think of. I've never heard The Police album, but then again I'd rather have my toes hacked off by a pair of pliers. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2396 Registered: 10-2004 |
I also think 1977 is totally off. At least in my circles, 77 has always been just as revered as the Clash debut, if not more. I think you could have a more meaningful discussion if you pitted the Clash debut with the first Damned album, or something like that. Also, I've never heard anyone describe Lexicon of Love as overrated. If anything, it seems like people give it more or less the level of praise it deserves. It actually seems to get more praise now than it did at the time. The 1991 entry is interesting because I would almost argue that Teenage Fanclub were more overrated at the time, at least here in the US. That year they got LOADS of airtime on MTV's "alternative" video program 120 minutes, even more than My Bloody Valentine. Even the local "alternative" radio station played Teenage Fanclub songs more than "Only Shallow." Yet, Loveless became a massive critical hit, much more after the fact, to the point where now more people probably like or know of MBV than Teenage Fanclub. But at the time, Teenage Fanclub were much more accessible and palatable, and MTV and radio certainly treated them as such. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 4457 Registered: 05-2005 |
Bandwagonesque was Spin's record of the year in 1991. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1707 Registered: 10-2008 |
Bandwagonesque was also No2 in the NME albums of the year 1991. Behind Nevermind by Nirvana, which is inferior in my book. | ||
| Geoff Holmes Member Username: Geoff Post Number: 808 Registered: 05-2005 |
What a great excuse to ruffle a few feathers and really tell you what I think! I have both of the '67 albums and it is, without ANY hesistation or doubt that I can say that it HAS to be the other way around!!!!! Most people haven't heard of Love, but how could anyone resist "You set the scene"? Those WEARY trumpets.....!!!!! Meanwhile, whilst being lauded in '67 by PAUL McCARTNEY (danger, danger, danger skulldisco!!!!) [and it DOES have a GREAT psychedelic cover by the Fool (who did the inner record sleeve for Sgt Pepper)], the 5000 spirits is TOTAL garbage. I was talking to an older collegue of mine who bought the follow up (the Hangman's Beautiful Daughter)in the 60's when it came out and he concurred with me that the Incredible String band were tuneless, anti-singers who must have been supplying "sunshine" to all the movers and shakers....either that and most likely, all the movers and shakers WERE on acid when they appraised it. Anyone who likes the album must be like Morrissey on Hand in Glove! He played the Hangman's daughter once. The 5000 spirits is actually less likeable. Total garbage. Avoid...and don't forget, PAUL McCARTNEY liked it!!!!! By the way...what has happened to the font in this messageboard? | ||
| Geoff Holmes Member Username: Geoff Post Number: 809 Registered: 05-2005 |
Zenyatta Mondatta IS mostly crap. About 2 good pop songs on it and A LOT of filler. They said so at the time. Who overrated it??? Unforgettable fire...yeah yeah, BRIAN ENO all hail!!! Boring album that didn't work and I like some U2 stuff. The dB's Repercussion was definately overrated. I haerd what they SHOULD have sounded like a year later: R.E.M. Murmur. Bandwagonesque started that whole idea that Teenage Fanclub=The Byrds: GET OFF THE GRASS!!! The Wall - duh. It was Pink Floyd in the 70's. Of COURSE it would be overrated. Someone was nearly as bored as me writing this response to come up with such a lame idea. No wonder I haven't bought an NME for 25 years! | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1709 Registered: 10-2008 |
Christ, and I was thinking about buying that Incredible String Rubbish album too!! Oh, and NME? | ||
| Stuart Wilson Member Username: Stuart Post Number: 558 Registered: 10-2006 |
I went to a mate's house recently where his wife had put together several hours of Incredible String Band music, without hearing most of it first: she thought it would be interesting dinner listening. I was a guest so I couldn't say anything but after about half an hour of this cats-mating-in-the-gutter-with-flutes-up -their-a***s torture finally her husband leapt to his feet screaming, "Take this stuff off for the love of god take it off!!!" They'd always been on my must-try-someday music, but no longer. | ||
| andreas Member Username: Andreas Post Number: 975 Registered: 04-2006 |
maybe the ISB was underrated at their time, now they are absolutely overrated. their albums are now hailed as great pieces of rock/folk music. i bought the hangman album in the beginning of the eighties. there were times i liked it, but most often i disliked it. therfore i nver bought the other albums of them. from time to time i tried to listen to the other albums (or songs from that albums), but i always failed to like this stuff, even when friends say that this stuff is great and weird. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2918 Registered: 03-2005 |
Wow, I haven't heard Incredible String Band in probably at least 35 years. I don't remember being much moved by them but I lumped them in with the (in my jaded view) humorless prog muso crowd and I liked trashy rock n roll by people who could hardly play. It's hard to imagine that their music will have aged well but since I honestly can't remember it I can't say much, can I? I love your story Stuart. I will say this: Jeff's report of his stepfather's account of Love is accurate. "Alone Again Or" was a nice medium-sized hit from "Forever Changes" but the album itself didn't get any big recognition at the time. So, if we were using the time frame of original release the O would go to the Incredible String Band and the U would unquestionably go to the Love album. It wouldn't even be close because that ISB album got a lot of distribution on the West Coast of the States back then. For '79, I'd say O: London Calling/U: Secondhand Daylight I don't think I've ever actually heard the db's. I certainly agree that "Swoon" is a definite U, but I'll have to think about what I would put up against it as the O. I've never heard that Comsat Angels album. Does anybody here agree with the U rating for it? | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2397 Registered: 10-2004 |
Randy, yes, that Comsat Angels album is definitely underrated. They were one of those bands that had a relatively small but devoted cult following and pretty solid critical support, but never anything beyond that. A bit like the Sound, in that regard (and partly why they frequently get mentioned in the same breath as the Sound, even though they sound different). | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2919 Registered: 03-2005 |
I just went to my computer list of CDs I have and did a 1984 search. A person could have great fun with this by pitting records you like against each other. So . . . against Swoon as the U, I could cheat and make it easy and put Hyaena as the O but I don't remember anybody actually O'ing Hyaena. Rattlesnakes (Lloyd Cole) as the O? Pacific Street (Pale Fountains)? (Cue Jeff's passionate defense.) Or, flip it. If Everybody's Fantastic (Microdisney) is your U (a Microdisney album cannot be an O by definition) does Swoon become O? Which of your loved ones will you push overboard? | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 2398 Registered: 10-2004 |
Ha! Randy, I'd say neither of the Pale Fountains LPs could qualify for an O by definition. They both did rather poorly. But I think you could do something like Pacific Street for a U vs. the Smiths' debut for an O. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1710 Registered: 10-2008 |
Randy, Jeff - Maybe one of the reason Comsat Angels and The Sound get lumped together is because they did a tour of the UK together. I think The Sound were promoting From The Lions Mouth, and The Comsat Angels were promoting Sleep No More (the album after Waiting For A Miracle). Both bands agreed to headline on alternate nights. I saw them at Edinburgh Nite Moves in September 1981, The Comsats headlined, and I remember my friend and I missed the last train home so we just spent the night in the train station, as you did when you were young free and single!! Another reason they are twinned together is possibly because both bands back catalogue was reissued several years ago by Renascent Records. I love threads like this one, it reminds me to dig out records I havent played for a while so From The Lions Mouth and Sleep No More are in the pile of CD's to be played soon. I remember being on holiday in Blackpool and buying Waiting For A Miracle by The Comsats and The Affectionate Punch by The Associates in the week they were both released, that same week I also bought Simply Thrilled Honey by Orange Juice and Its Kinda Funny by Josef K, the only problem was I had to wait for a week before I could get home to play them!! Its funny how all this is imprinted on my mind and I can hardly remember what I did last week. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 2920 Registered: 03-2005 |
Jeff, I put up "Pacific Street" as a proposal because at the time the Pale Fountains were thought to be the Next Big Thing. And then they weren't. Plus, IMO it's not nearly as good an album as the next one. Michael Head hadn't quite yet shaken off his weird goal to be the next Tony Macaulay. Kevin, I think it's time for me to pull out that Sound album. I tend to listen to "Jeopardy" and "Propaganda" more because, well, I like trashy rock 'n roll. Orange Juice are always a challenge for me; I can't escape the impression that Edwyn Collins sounds like Viv Stanshall of the Bonzo Dog Band doing spoofs of the old-style crooners. In my mind I always see a singing beagle when I hear him. Whereas the appeal of Josef k is enduring. | ||
| skulldisco Member Username: Skulldisco Post Number: 1718 Registered: 10-2008 |
Listening to Waiting For A Miracle today it is definitely underrated in my opinion. Although The Affectionate Punch would be my choice for 1980's underrated album. My recollection, although admittedly hazy, is that the Comsats album got far more positive critical acclaim at the time than The Associates did, although within a year The Associates were critical darlings. |