| Author | Message | ||
     Lawrence Mikkelsen Member Username: Simplythrilledhoney Post Number: 11 Registered: 03-2006 |
The two most underrated Go-Bs albums, surely? I'm going to out myself as a MASSIVE fan of these two records. I think that "Spring Hill Fair" is better than "Before Hollywood", and (this is probably blasphemy here) I think that, were it not for the presence of "Cut it Out", "Tallulah" would be the single best Go-Betweens album. There. I've said it ... | ||
| Lawrence Mikkelsen Member Username: Simplythrilledhoney Post Number: 12 Registered: 03-2006 |
... and further to that - try substituting "When People Are Dead" (from around the same period) for "Cut it Out". | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 153 Registered: 05-2005 |
you wont find much arguament from me Lawrence. i think overall B4H'WOOD is my favourite, but on any given day SHF, TALLULAH and LBATBDE could be. They are certainly my top 4. Also agree with what you say about Cut it Out, for me this was the first step towards the attempt to "cross over" which led to the full blown sell out of 16LL | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 221 Registered: 05-2005 |
Kevin, enough already. The Go-Betweens did not sell out by recording Lovers Lane any more than Celtic sold out by seeking success through signing Larrson, Thompson, Balde, Keane etc. | ||
| gareth w Member Username: Gareth Post Number: 48 Registered: 05-2005 |
I don't think they've ever 'sold out' but surely replacing Lindy with a drum machine on 'Spring Hill Fair' and going for more of an 80's production sound is closer to it than '16 Lovers Lane'? | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 154 Registered: 05-2005 |
Point taken Padraig, i was going to expand my post by saying that maybe they could hardly be blamed for wanting to cross over(and in turn make more money)because Im sure they were fed up being skint. Its one of the great ironies in life that lots of the best bands and musicians prior to the 1990s made sod all money when they were at their peak - critical praise came in spades but unfortunately doesnt pay the rent. Its one of my great bugbears that talentless crap (hello kaiser chiefs,blunt,coldplay,keane ad nauseum) are now stinking rich and bands like Wire, Joy Division, The Velvets, Gof4, Pixies,Husker Du, Replacements, AMC etc etc couldnt get arrested when they were at their peak. Is it just me or do you hear Husker Du everywhere these days, played out through the karaoke type songs of Green Day and their ilk? Anyway, as usual Ive went off on a tangent (and a rant!), so yes Padraig I kinda agree with you up to a point. Still think 16LL is the dog turd of the Go-B's canon though. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 199 Registered: 10-2004 |
i think spring hill fair is a fine album, and it's usually ranked 2nd or 3rd in my mental list of go-betweens album rankings. the thing is, it has lot's of really strong individual songs, but as an album, i don't think it's very cohesive. songs like bachelor kisses, 5 words, part company, slow slow music, unkind and unwise, draining the pool for you, are all very strong and demonstrate in spades exactly what makes the go-betweens so brilliant. but here's what i think should've happened (and i've said this before, which always results in people telling me i'm crazy, but here goes anyway...), i think if they had substituted 'rare breed' in place of 'the old way out,' and had they put 'king in mirrors' in place of 'river of money,' that would place spring hill fair firmly in 2nd place for me, instead of in a tentative 2nd place. i think 'rare breed' and 'mirrors' are way better than the two songs i would personally have them replace. and to me it's always been a crime that that those songs have always been relegated as b-sides. tallulah also suffers from a lack of cohesion, but i think it's also got lackluster production and smaller quantity of outstanding songs working against it as well. for me, i always felt like the singles from tallulah veered a bit too close to MOR. but i love songs like 'someone else's wife,' 'then you tell me,' 'house jack kerouac built,' 'i just get caught out,' and 'the clarke sisters.' i agree that it's a shame 'when people are dead' wasn't recorded in time to be included on the album. and i disagree wholeheartedly about 16LL being the "dog turd" (as kevin put it) of the canon. glossy production aside (which i really don't mind on 16LL, to me it kind of suits the music), i think it's a very strong and inspired batch of tunes. to me, the dog turd of the canon is easily 'rachel worth.' | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 219 Registered: 03-2005 |
Jeff, your idea of a "Spring Hill Fair" with "Rare Breed" and "King in Mirrors" intrigues me. I think I'll burn up a version this weekend. Would you put the songs in the same spots as the deleted ones? I love SHF; I definitely listen to it more often than Before Hollywood. I don't agree that "Tallulah" has lackluster production. In my view, it's the first GoBees album with intricately detailed arrangements, presumably thanks to Amanda. While I love "When People are Dead," it cannot be used to replace "Cut it Out." That messes up the Robert/Grant balance. We need a Grant song. Any suggestions anyone? | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 201 Registered: 10-2004 |
randy, yeah, i would put the songs in the same spots as the deleted ones. that way you've got an upbeat song (rare breed) replacing an upbeat song (old way out), and a downtempo song (mirrors) replacing a downtempo song (river). but the problem is that a suitable version of 'rare breed' doesn't exist. my favorite version, from the peel sessions, has the best guitar work, arrangement, and tempo, but the thin sound just wouldn't jive with the full and lush sound of 'spring hill fair'. the b-side version is too rough sounding and a bit sluggish, while the demo version is nice but some of the guitar melodies lack a certain resolution which they had later worked out by the time they recorded the peel sessions. i suppose the demo version might fit the best for the sake of sonic cohesion. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 202 Registered: 10-2004 |
oh, and i probably should've specified that i'm talking about the b-side version of 'king in mirrors,' not the one they did for a BBC session (that's included on the 'before hollywood' bonus disc). i like both versions, but the b-side version (which, sadly, never made it onto the spring hill fair reissue bonus disc), has the same production qualities as the rest of 'spring hill fair,' and would therefore sit better on that album, i think. | ||
| Wilson Davey Member Username: Wilson Post Number: 51 Registered: 05-2005 |
I'm still obsessed by the early version of "I just caught out". It was on a "Sounds showcase" single free with Sounds music paper. Is it on any GB's CD...maybe the expanded Tallulah which I don't have ? | ||
| Carsten Olbrich Member Username: Mr_ebu Post Number: 3 Registered: 06-2006 |
I have always some favourite-songs in my head, played by my "inner broadcaster". And so I found out that 5 songs from "Tallulah" are always coming back to the top from time to time: Bye Bye Pride, Right Here, The Clarke Sisters, Hope Then Strife and... off course... one of the greatest and most exzessive cult-songs till eternity: The House Jack Kerouac Built. That's why Tallulah is absolutely not underrated to me and my friends - and I do know a lot of people who are in love with the GoBs. | ||
| Dusty Member Username: Dusty Post Number: 31 Registered: 05-2005 |
Jeff, It's funny what you say about 'Rare Breed' replacing 'The Old way Out' as it's exactly what I did about 2 weeks ago when I fiddled around and made a new copy of SHF. I found it a bit hard to do because I don't think 'The Old way out' is a very poor song but it's just a relatively slight song at a crucial point in the album (although it does seque well into the classic 'You've never lived'). I used the demo version which, although perhaps slightly inferior to the Peel version (but both are way ahead of the B-side version) does sound 'right' production-wise. Anyway, I find it beefs up the album no end. I ended up editing 'River of money' to a much shorter length as I feel it's an OK track but kind of drags a bit - it's hard to edit though because there are a few classic McLennan lines in there. Using 'Audio Editor' to get the volumes right, I then beefed up 'Bachelor Kisses' (very quiet on the normal cd) and 'Man O'Sand ( a bit quiet espeically as a rousing finale). The album just hangs so much better for me now. I'm intrigued about the idea of King in Mirrors but sadly the B-side version hasn't been released on cd yet so can't substitute it anywhere, although I agree it's strong enough to put on outright. | ||
| Dusty Member Username: Dusty Post Number: 32 Registered: 05-2005 |
Wilson Re: 'I just get caught out' - Yes, it was released on the bonus disc of the reissue of Tallulah. It's excellent sound quality and compares very well to the album version - both equally strong but fairly different sounding. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 490 Registered: 05-2005 |
I actually think that as far underrated albums by the GB's go, that it depends at what point in time you listen to them, what circles you move in and, probably how old you are. I would never say that the GB's early stuff is underrated, because in all my teen years my friends and I would play each album as it came out as much the other, continually proclaiming its greatness. this hasn't stopped all these years later, I was 14 when I first heard them, and am 38 now. I don't think any GB's fan should think that any album is underrated, coz in all of our GB's fans hearts we know we love them all, each loved in our own personal special way. just coz we play one more than another, or is talked about more means its underrated... That's my opinion. Now what's the most overrated!!? Of course, there isn't one!! Not even the lushness of 16LL will ever make me think its overrated. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 123 Registered: 01-2005 |
Spring Hill Fair sure has a checkered past with no US release until the BB mid 90's reissues. So it got off to a rough start. I don't know if I would call it underated though. It certainly packs a punch, sonically speaking. I think it stands up equally with BH and Tallulah, but maybe a slight notch behind 16LL and LBATBDE. I love all five of them though and make it six with Oceans Apart. FORW, BYBO and SMAL get less play, but I still listen to them a couple times a year. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 361 Registered: 10-2004 |
dusty - yeah, i tried that too with 'rare breed,' and i felt like it worked pretty well. and yeah, it's not that i have anything against 'the old way out' either, i really do like it. but it does come off as somewhat slight compared to most of the other songs on the record. as for 'king in mirrors,' i burned a copy onto cd straight from the vinyl. there are a few crackles and pops, but it works! i think i mentioned in a post way up above that i had wanted to swap it with 'river of money.' it works, although it felt a bit strange coming right after 'draining.' | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 452 Registered: 03-2005 |
I don't have the b-side of "Mirrors" either so unfortunately I can't reproduce what Jeff is doing. It sounds like a nice modification. But I confess I really like the perverse anti-pop of "River of Money." It has some wonderful Grant McL visuals especially the windblown curtains stroking the strings of the abandoned guitar. I definitely find it more listenable than, say, "Eight Pictures." Does Tallulah have anything wrong with it other than "Cut It Out?" I don't think so. | ||
| Guy Ewald Member Username: Guy_ewald Post Number: 166 Registered: 02-2005 |
It's heartening to read that other people "tinker" with albums and burn custom editions. I haven't rejigged any Go-Betweens albums, but I have done single-disc expanded editions of the LP's-proper along with the b-sides and such. And yes, I did tinker with the normalization on 'Bachelor Kisses' and the opening chords of 'Five Words.' I've done vinyl transfers of the originally-released versions of 'Rare Breed' and 'King in Mirrors', combed-out the ticks and pops (nice to have on disc). Those are the versions I used on my custom SHF, although I agree that the Peel recording of 'Rare Breed' locks into the most confident groove. Several years ago I put together a disc of the G-B's non-LP material and need I say that it was a rock solid gathering, near equal to any pair of Go-Betweens albums you might choose. Tops in Quality Control. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 1018 Registered: 05-2005 |
I have this new game on the msg board, close your eyes and click, then leave a msg on whetever thread appears on screen. Right, the albums in the opening thread are not underrated. Next? | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 960 Registered: 04-2005 |
Don't you have songs you should be writing for the next Winnebago Orchestra album, Spence?  | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 921 Registered: 05-2005 |
Kurt, you can do it, you can reach 1000 before the week is out. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 922 Registered: 05-2005 |
I'm just writing any kind of frivolous stuff now in an 11th hour attempt to catch up. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 961 Registered: 04-2005 |
And I'm answering in a cheap ploy to maintain a slight lead and nudge that much closer to 1,000. Cheers! | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 924 Registered: 05-2005 |
A very clever ploy, no doubt. But I'm onto it. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 925 Registered: 05-2005 |
And speaking of no doubt; their namesakes No Doubt are my vote for the worst band ever. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 926 Registered: 05-2005 |
And their former lead singer Gwen Stefani is the least talented multi-millionaire pop star ever. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 927 Registered: 05-2005 |
I know I'm just trying to catch up to Kurt to get to 1000 posts first (well, first after Kevin, LK and Spence); but I really did hate No Doubt and could never in any way understand how people with above average interest in and taste in music could like them. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 928 Registered: 05-2005 |
Genuinely hate Gwen Stafani too. Utter crap. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 962 Registered: 04-2005 |
OK, Padraig, these aren't kosher post count enhancing tactics. Chatting with yourself in an empty room doesn't count. Though you're right about Gwen Stefani...second-rate Madonna wannabe. And Madonna was never that great in the first place. Though she was on the same label as Spring Hill Fair was released on (Sire), so I've managed to make this a legit post by tying it back into the original subject. That's how it's done, Padraig! | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 930 Registered: 05-2005 |
Nice work again Kurt. Did I mention that I love Tallulah and recently bought the double disc version? I previously had a 'burned' copy, as well as the original CD issue of it. And now I have the double disc version too. | ||
| Stuart Wilson Member Username: Stuart Post Number: 32 Registered: 10-2006 |
I have a small, energetic, very hungry beagle, and so I spend a lot of my time gloving my fingers with supermarket bags and hefting dog turds, and never, ever, at that moment, do I feel like comparing what I have in my hand with 16 Lover's Lane... I mean, it's so strange to hear such negative things said about a work that seems to me like the perfect culmination of the albums leading up to it, with the band finally shedding the akward angularities of their youth, building on the great songs like BachelorKisses, Part Company, Diving the pool, Byebyepride, Spring Rain to produce a lush, perfect pop masterpiece, wonderful tunes, intelligent lyrics, from the ebullient opening chords to the tremendous dying fall of DiveForYourMemory...ah, would that all dogturds were like this! | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 1032 Registered: 05-2005 |
Kurt, we've recorded em! Nearly there boys! |