| Author | Message | ||
     kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 675 Registered: 05-2005 |
What are the albums that you really looked forward to that turned out to be turkeys? I suppose Dylan fans will say every album from 78-89  Off the top of my head. Riot City Blues by Primal Scream. Should have known by the title I suppose. Lets Dance by David Bowie. This is where the rot started setting in. Give Em Enough Rope by The Clash. Maybe not a turkey, but this was probably the album that over the years I had looked forward to the most, and almost inevitably it was a let down. Whoever suggested Sandy Pearlman as a producer needs shot. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 601 Registered: 05-2005 |
The The - Mindbomb The White Striped - Elephant REM - The last one... | ||
| Gee Member Username: Gee Post Number: 5 Registered: 11-2005 |
It's by no means a turkey but sadly... Oceans Apart. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 676 Registered: 05-2005 |
Oh Gee, you're in bother now. I'm still getting flak about my indifference to 16LL, and that was ages ago. Which has just reminded me of another for my list | ||
| XY765 Member Username: Judge Post Number: 78 Registered: 01-2006 |
The Flaming Lips latest 'At war with the mystics' | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 496 Registered: 03-2005 |
Nick Cave -- Henry's Dream. Put me off him for years. The Fall -- Levitate. I concluded the Fall were dead. The Fauves -- Thousand Yard Stare. With so many recommendations and such a great title, how could I ever guess they were a Tubes revival band? Belle & Sebastian -- Boy with the Arab Strap. I had loved Tigermilk so much. Robert Forster -- Warm Nights Scott Walker -- The Drift Captain Beefheart -- Unconditionally Guaranteed Dusty Springfield -- White Heat. Coke had ruined the voice and the selected material was execrable. Lou Reed & John Cale -- Songs for Drella. This one almost killed me with disappointment! It was just boring. Shelley/Devoto -- I hadn't learned my lesson. I had the very same experience again. The list goes on . . . . | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 605 Registered: 05-2005 |
Randy I'd forgotton how boring Devoto's solo outing was...Haven't heard The Drify yet but what I have heard smple wise from itunes it sounds like he's got an engineer to mess with a TR606 drum machine a lot. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 158 Registered: 01-2005 |
REM -- Green. I couldn't believe they went downhill so far from Document. Lou Reed -- Mistrial. After the great Blue Mask, the almost great Legendary Hearts and the very good New Sensations, Lou released his worse album of the 80's in Mistrial. Bangles -- Different Light. What happened to the power pop that was on the previous All Over The Place? | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 452 Registered: 04-2005 |
Pavement - Terror Twilight (dead on arrival) Yo La Tengo - Summer Sun (boring, boring, boring) The Clash - Combat Rock (all subtlety lost) David Bowie - Tonight (Let's Dance was a huge disappointment, but seemed like it was just a one-off; Tonight was when I realized it was over for Mr. Jones) Elvis Costello - North (if you're going to be a torch singer, Elvis, write some melodies first) R.E.M. - Reveal (same deal as Bowie--Up was the warning sign; Reveal was the nail in the coffin) Ian Hunter - Short Back 'n Sides (I had high hopes for this because his previous solo album had been good and Mick Jones of the Clash produced. Nope--this was terrible. Not a single track I wanted to hear more than once.) Steely Dan - Gaucho (sorry, Hardin) Television - self-titled (the early '90s album; not bad, but more like a Verlaine solo album--the old TV magic wasn't there) Bob Mould - Black Sheets of Rain (irritating guitar sludge, overlong songs, and self-pitying lyrics--a terrible followup to Workbook) Pixies - their next studio album, if they make one (c'mon, we all know it's not going to live up to expectations) | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 606 Registered: 05-2005 |
kurt i loved the television album, tiy really not rate it? suppose i like it for the guitar work tho and yes the bob album wasnt a patch on workbook... | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 580 Registered: 03-2006 |
Kurt, no worries mate. Gaucho, as well as Combat Rock, is in the syllabus for Disappointing Albums 101. I guess because I'm perverse and like to go against the grain I've found things to like in both of them. They have some great songs on them. Babylon Sisters, from Gaucho, is one of the great L.A. sleaze songs. LK's interpretation: it's about a scumbag producer type (picture Ari from Entourage) taking his two (possibly hooker) girlfriends to the beach, trying to convince them (really more himself) that it's real love, not a one night stand, not a "weekend in TJ". And "Time Out of Mind" cracks me up because it's a completely unapologetic glorification of heroin abuse. Now of course, drug abuse is bad, but art or literature that doesn't acknowledge that people use drugs because it's a lot of f-ing fun falls flat and seems naive. Combat Rock has lots of fairly out there experimentation, but some undeniably cool tunes - "Stay or Go", "Straight to Hell" and "Red Angel Dragnet" - any song that references Taxi Driver is OK in my book. I think it's far from the most disappointing album in their catalog. That honor would go either to Cut the Crap or Give 'Em Enough Rope. I agree Kev - the heavy metallish production didn't work at all and totally denatured the songs and robbed them of their personality. It wasn't till I saw live footage of them playing Safe European Home that I realized what a great flippin tune it was! Go figure, I thought the Television album was quite good, too. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 453 Registered: 04-2005 |
I need to clarify--the Television album is good, no question. It's just not "Marquee Moon," but what is? I almost put "Adventure" as a disappointing album too. It's just hard to follow a perfect album, I guess. I'll grant you that "Combat Rock" has some genuine experimentation and some surprisingly uncommercial impulses for what ended up as such a big hit, but I the songs were generally weak and it wasn't much fun to listen to. The only decent rocker on the album was "Should I Stay or Should I Go?" which is kind of depressing by Clash standards. "Gaucho" = interesting lyrics, bad everything else. The album that best sums up everything Kev hates about American MOR! | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 454 Registered: 04-2005 |
By the way, I briefly played guitar with a band where the lead singer was a woman who claimed to be a huge Clash fan. She said their best album by far was "Give 'Em Enough Rope" and she felt "The Clash" and "London Calling" weren't anything special. Needless to say, her band wasn't one I stayed in. You can't forgive a lapse in taste like that. That album has about six or seven great Clash songs buried in standard American late-'70s hard rock production. All the songs go on too long also. I'd love to hear the demos for the album, though. Imagine how good it would have been with Guy Stevens or Lee Perry ("Complete Control"!) producing. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 608 Registered: 05-2005 |
Kurt cool, agree. The Clash albums were great really when you look back. I think we're being picky. When the forst one was out I remember at primary school all the older guys freaking out, but when rope came out it was like Clash had arrived... | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 581 Registered: 03-2006 |
I think Kev has shown that MOR is in the eye of the beholder. 'Sides, isn't citing one of SD's albums as "MOR" kind of like handing out speeding tickets at the Indy 500? "Rope" has some undeniably great songs, tis true. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 496 Registered: 05-2005 |
13 by Teenage Fanclub. One Sided Story by The Pursuit Of Happiness (though I like it a lot now). Room To Roam by The Waterboys (though I played the old tape last night and thought it was better than I'd remembered). Each of the above followed stone classic albums: Bandwagonesque, Love Junk and Fisherman's Blues. Randy, I did try to warn you to be careful with The Fauves, that they are very hit and miss. Also, Randy, I love Songs For Drella. It's one of my favourite ever albums. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 500 Registered: 03-2005 |
Oh well, Padraig. We can't agree on everything. You probably did warn me about the Fauves. I've found that Augie March is acquitting themselves well in the "shuffle" mode on my iPod. One song at a time--other than the overly earnest major label sound of "One Crowded Hour"--scattered among whatever else I have on the device seems to be a good means of slowly absorbing the album. | ||
| Pádraig Collins Member Username: Pádraig_collins Post Number: 500 Registered: 05-2005 |
I agree with you that One Crowded Hour has a major label sound Randy - I thought pretty much they same thing myself the other day; but I would not read that as a bad thing in this case. There is a depth to Augie March's songwriting that would be lost on an indie budget. Lo-fi they ain't. This is going to be my 500th post and I have just noticed that yours above was also number 500! We're each batting 500 Randy! | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 618 Registered: 05-2005 |
Kev's number one spot though, we salute you "Sir Kev!" | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 683 Registered: 05-2005 |
Cheers Spence, but for sheer volume of posts over a shorter period of time, its hats off to Hardin and his twin brother Lil Keith. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 595 Registered: 03-2006 |
You're too kind, Kevin. When you prorate all my posts out for meaningful content, it's more like a hundred or so...YOU'RE the champ, baby! All hail the Conquering Kev! | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 619 Registered: 05-2005 |
"And a glass of white wine for the lady!!" | ||
| Jerry Clark Member Username: Jerry Post Number: 372 Registered: 08-2004 |
Krafwerk - Electric Cafe (for the first time they were behind the times) Electronic - Electronic (could have been the perfect pop group but turned out AOR) Talking Heads - Little Creatures (from the funkiest punks ever to country-rock radio-whores, not all bad though) Public Image Ltd - Flowers Of Romance (not the same without the Wobble) | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 688 Registered: 05-2005 |
Jerry, spot on. Spence, you're not so bad yourself, you plus 600 floozy you!! | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 463 Registered: 04-2005 |
Good ones, Jerry. How could we all have forgotten "Flowers of Romance"? What a big piece of nothing that was. Although I'd say the bigger disappointment for Talking Heads was the tepid "True Stories." And "Naked" wasn't so hot either. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 508 Registered: 03-2005 |
I possess, but haven't listened to either "Little Creatures" or "True Stories" in many years. It was the latter that put me off TH altogether. I'll usually allow one clunker but if the next one is the same, that's it--I'm gone. For me, with the Cocteaus, the one-two punch was "Blue Bell Knoll" and "Heaven or Las Vegas," which reminds me I'm supposed to listen to those again and see if I still don't like them. I don't really get PIL. I have "Metal Box" and "Flowers" and, for that matter, some of the hilariously appalling session musician crap Lydon did under their name here in Los Angeles later in the 80s. "Metal Box" always seemed light on actual musical content. | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 623 Registered: 05-2005 |
This weekend I have played MORE SONGS ABOUT BUILDINGS AND FOOD by Talking Heads, its so good, what an album, I can see how influential they were and still are just by this one magnificent album. I still adore '77 but this is special, the funk really came in here, real Velvets similarities in tehre too. after Speaking in Tongues, The HEads can forget it. Lazy was a great track by Mr Byrne. Also played XTC's English Settlement. As far as I am concerned this alubum is a classic, 24 years on (can't believe where the time has gone). Its a 'very English' record, but again, is like Talking Heads at theire best, unique, excellent musicianship, catchy, clever, idiosyncratic. | ||
| Elizabeth Robinson Member Username: Liz_the_new_listener Post Number: 15 Registered: 10-2006 |
Thom Yorke - The Eraser. Alas, too diffuse, and not enough guitars to give it staying power... | ||
| John B. Member Username: John_b Post Number: 29 Registered: 10-2006 |
Every REM album post-Automatic (the only exception being Around the Sun which has its moments) Talking Heads album post-Remain in Light, Ultravox post the !-days without John Foxx and Radiohead post-OK Computer. Kurt, I agree that Television went downhill after Marquee Moon for exactly the reason you mentioned. Ditto for The Clash, Sandinista has its moments, that's all, as I said elsewhere, it would have probably been a great double album without the fillers. And Kevin, even worse than you predicted: Being soso about Dylan, Modern Times is the first regular album I bought since Desire! | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 1046 Registered: 05-2005 |
Elizabeth - The Eraser is close to being my album of the year John - Kid A is better than The Bends and OK Computer imo You wouldnt want to see Thom Yorke standing still would you, by creating Kid A, Amnesiac ,and The Eraser he proved he was evolving artistically - I have no explanation for why he decided to regress with the last turgid Radiohead album Hail To The Thief | ||
| John B. Member Username: John_b Post Number: 31 Registered: 10-2006 |
Well, Kevin, I guess it comes down to taste. Plus I am quite a traditionalist when it comes to artistic evolution. A new album doesn't have to sound exactly like the predecessor, but I often have a problem with bands who change style in quite a big way. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 286 Registered: 01-2005 |
Lots of folks with different opinions on what album turned them off the Talking Heads. I'll agree with Spence on Speaking in Tongues being the last one I wasn't disapointed with. I never did buy True Stories, but I did buy Naked and was not pleased. It only took me 10 years, but I fianlly bought REM's New Adventures in Hi-Fi. I know that only half the songs are decent, but being it's the last one with Bill Berry I decided to give it a try. Is it better than Monster? | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 785 Registered: 04-2005 |
In that "New Adventures" has some variety and isn't all noisy, guitar-heavy tracks, I suppose it's better than "Monster." But the album is way, way too long, so it's grueling to listen to straight through. And the tracks recorded live are annoyingly muddy sounding. Unlike a lot of people here, I thought "Little Creatures" was a pretty good Talking Heads album because they had exhausted the funk/African niche and getting back to the sparer quartet sound was a refreshing change. I guess some see it as a cynical, commercial ploy. I thought it was just the music they felt like making at the time. "True Stories," though, is where they really lost it. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1005 Registered: 03-2006 |
Am in "agreeance" with Mr. Kurt. I like Little Creatures, too, and thought it had a lot of really good songs on it, completely deserving of a place in the TH pantheon, like "And She Was" and "Road to Nowhere"...And I do think it was an extremely conscious retrenchment from funk, polyrhythm, whatever you want to call it. They had taken that path as far as they could. And yes, True Stories was, in fact, a big slab of deep-fried poo poo. The "movie" for which it was the soundtrack was pretty dang silly, too. However much you might love your little pop idols, sometimes you just can't go there with them. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 289 Registered: 01-2005 |
True Stories, the "movie", hard to believe it was 20 years ago that I saw it in the theatre. Kurt and LK, I see you point about "Little Creatures" and haven taken the Remain in Light sound as far as they could. I do like some of the songs on it, so I would say it's the best of the TH albums after 1983. What's the odds of Byrne making peace with Tina, Jerry and Chris and reforming the band? Pretty slim at this point? | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1007 Registered: 03-2006 |
There are a lot of albums that I'm aware are known to be disappointing albums, but what registers most strongly is when you have personal experience of their being disappointing. When you look forward to their coming out, go to your record store the day they come out, plunk down your cash. Then you go home, stick 'em in the CD player, then..welcome to Crestfallen City, Pal. No f-in refunds - your little pop idol has pulled a fast one on you...like it or lump it... Two stick out for me that way: "Under the Red Sky" - Bob Dylan Coming on the heels of "Oh Mercy" as this one did, I had high hopes. But, oh mercy, what a piece of ca ca. "Wiggle Wiggle"? Are you kidding me, Bob? "Human Touch" and "Lucky Town" (or was it Human Town and Lucky Touch?) - Bruce Springsteen I, once again, had high hopes. These were Bruce's first proper (full-blooded, band) albums after disbanding the E Street Band. I'm afraid I drank the Koolaid. Bruce writes the songs, so he don't need no stinkin' E St. Band, right? Wrong. He needs the E Street Band, and has, imo, produced his best music with their accompaniment... | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 290 Registered: 01-2005 |
"Human Touch" and "Lucky Town", I have to agree with you on those being clunkers. In fact, I don't have one of them, but I forgot which one it is that I don't have. I think it's "Lucky Town". Goes to show you how much I have played HT over the years. As far a needing the E Street Band, I'll agree with you on that one as well except for "Nebraska", which although it is depressing as hell it has great songs. Spreaking of Bruce, why has it taken CBS/Columbia so long to release cd reissues? My "Darkness" and "The River" cd's sound like crap. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 1049 Registered: 05-2005 |
LK, you will know I'm not the biggest fan of The Boss(apart from Nebraska), but I think you have hit on something about him not being as good without the E Street band. Now, I couldnt tell you if my life depended on it what albums they appear on, but I would hazard a guess at Born To Run where even though I didnt care for the songs I could tell the band kicked ass. Anyway, what I was going to say was, do you think the same applies to EC and The Attractions here? Most people would agree his best work was done with The Attractions, so I guess some groups just have a certain "chemistry" that cannot be reproduced by other musicians. I am sure we can come up with more examples. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1008 Registered: 03-2006 |
Well, I think it's largely true about EC and the Attractions, with one glaring exception: King of America, which is my fave by Elvis. Curiously though, that one still had Steve Nieve on it (actually I think those shitty Bruce albums still had Roy Bittan, his keyboardist on them, too). Come to think of it, I'm not sure Elvis has made an album without Nieve. A question a bigger EC geek than me would have to answer, but I don't think he has. Another good example is Byrne and Talking Heads...The Heads improved Byrne's songs exponentially, as we've seen from DB's solo records, though many have been very good. And, of course, the "Heads" without Byrne were even worse - did anyone else hear that travesty, "No Talking Just Head"? That was some rank shit. And yeah, Michael, Nebraska stands as a glaring exception, since it's arguably one of the great records ever. And, I like that song, "If I Should Fall Behind", which came from one of those records, which Grant covered, btw, but the rest of them was sheer bupkes. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 786 Registered: 04-2005 |
Michael, going back to your Talking Heads reunion question: nope, won't happen. They have appeared together publicly--for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame thing and for the Stop Making Sense re-release, but they didn't play together and said they won't. I'm pretty sure David and Tina still hate one another. And Byrne doesn't seem like the kind of guy who's interested in nostalgia--he moves on to new and different art projects. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 787 Registered: 04-2005 |
EC geek to the rescue, LK. Steve Nieve didn't play on "Spike," "Kojak Variety," or the Brodsky Quartet album...maybe some others too. He was barely on "King of America," I think--there was that one Attractions track, but I don't think he played on the other songs. I'd have to go along with the theory that EC did his best work with the Attractions--mostly because he can get kind of boring if he doesn't have a good rhythm section kicking his ass a little bit. And in the Thomas boys, he had one of the great rhythm sections. The current Imposters are almost as good--it's just a different bass player, after all. Too bad Bruce Thomas was such a tool, because he really is an extraordinarily interesting and melodic bass player. I'm not a Springsteen fan, but I don't dislike him either. I have to admit I haven't heard an entire album of his in years, but I always kind of liked "Tunnel of Love," which was a non-E Street Band album. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1009 Registered: 03-2006 |
Kurt, I know you read a lot of music related stuff - did you read David Bowman's book about Talking Heads? Veddy interesting, though technically not very well-written. He REALLY paints Tina as a petty and devious bitch. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 793 Registered: 04-2005 |
I read that book, LK, and enjoyed it thoroughly even if it wasn't a literary masterpiece. Neither David nor Tina came off too well, really. I found it interesting that Bowman came away from researching/writing the book liking the band's music less than he did going in. I guess the petty squabbles, jealousy, etc., really soured him. The part about how the "other three" were actually considering trying to kick Byrne out and replace him on vocals/guitar with Adrian Belew was especially interesting. | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 413 Registered: 10-2004 |
Friends of Rachel Worth | ||
| Elizabeth Robinson Member Username: Liz_the_new_listener Post Number: 21 Registered: 10-2006 |
Forgive me, Jeff - but I was very pleased with FORW myself. Being of an age with RF/GMcL, I can appreciate that although the qualities of the human soul and the human voice can mellow with age, 'you're only as old as you feel'. On some of the songs wisdom has increased, and on others the Go-Betweens simply have a blast. My dear LK - I may have been disappointed that the Eraser was not as tangy, and didn't have as many hooks as Radiohead (see how Grant McLennan's work has spoiled me?) - but there is no way I would not call it a good CD. The last song is particularly haunting and I only wish the best part had not literally dissolved from under my ears before the electronica swept it away. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1011 Registered: 03-2006 |
Elizabeth, I think you meant to refer to your dear Kevin, instead of your dear LK. Thanks for the endearment anyways... I agree with you about Eraser, more or less, btw...so so, but good in patches. My favorite parts of it remind me of Eno. Agree with you too about FORW. I think some don't like it because of it's flat, compressed sound, but I can live with that since the songs are so great. | ||
| Donat Member Username: Donat Post Number: 198 Registered: 11-2004 |
I see Friends Of Rachel Worth and Oceans Apart on here... HELLO?! I find them disappointing in the sense that Lindy and Amanda aren't on them, but that's about it. It's interesting to see how albums like Television's self-titled and the Reed/Cale album 'Songs for Drella' are on here. Okay - I am picking on Randy a little here, but I guess when you approach these 'reunion' albums with "a desperate kind of hope" to quote RF, you do set the bar a little too high. I do it myself all the time. When Grant gave me a pre-release of TFORW, I thought to myself "what the f...!?" but a Gobs reunion was just like being a child and seeing your divorced parents get back together, sort of thing. It was the sense of, "it's better something than nothing." I was lucky to see Warm Nights + Grant back in the mid-to-late 90s, a time when Forster's playing was at an all-time high, when the four of them flipped through the Go-Betweens and solo songs with such enthusiasm and energy and it's a shame that when RF and GM reconvened as The Go-Betweens, suddenly the band seemed a little more cautious in their approach as a band. That's what I hear in the Mk. 2 albums, so I guess I can understand how people can see them as a little disappointing. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 1053 Registered: 05-2005 |
Elizabeth, LK - its interesting that we may be coming from The Eraser at different angles. I know from a previous post that Elizabeth is a huge Radiohead fan, I guess that LK might be but I'm not sure. This may explain why they feel disappointment with The Eraser, because it does not have that Radiohead DNA. I, on the other hand think most of Radioheads output(save Kid A, and some parts of Amnesiac)is pompous, anthemic, anguished crap, sorry This might explain why I think The Eraser is a beautiful piece of music. | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 32 Registered: 08-2006 |
I'm with Donat. It took a while before I could hear the GBs MK II albums without the baggage of my expectations. TFORW was so stripped down - even a bit punky - that it didn't quite jibe with anything I'd come to expect from the band, together or solo. But by the time OA came out, I stopped thinking of MK II as a reunion and more of a continuation. Now, TFORW is one of the GBs CDs I play the most. LK, good call on the Boss CDs - I think they might be my gold standard for disappointment I remember leaving work at noon the day HT and LT came out, coming home and playing them and thinking, "the sky is falling." I was genuinely disappointed. That said, I played HT a week or so ago and was surprised to find a few songs I really enjoyed. I think there's a half-decent single CD between the two records, although LT laregly sounds like someone doing a half-passable Springsteen imitation, not the man himself. | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 33 Registered: 08-2006 |
EC's "Spike" was another big let-down, IMO. "Blood and Chocolate" was such a great album, and following "King of America"... The guy just seemed to be on a roll. And then "Spike." I don't expect everyone to agree with me, but I think EC jumped the shark then and there. I loathed "Mighty Like a Rose." I have and enjoy some of his later CDs, but there's nothing close to what I'd call a great album among them. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1012 Registered: 03-2006 |
Good geekery, Kurt! Of course Nieve didn't play on those, but they weren't springing to mind. I guess I have a mental block about Juliet Letters, probaby the least enjoyable, imo, in the canon. It just seems like a, I dunno, lab experiment, rather than an album someone might listen to for pleasure. And on Spike the piano uber-lord was the mighty and incredible Allen Toussaint. I think EC, like the Boss and the guy from the Hold Steady definitely profits from having a super melodic, highly arpeggiated pianist back him up... Hmmm, I loved Spike, Rob, though I agree heartily about Mighty Like a Rose, and Lordy did I want to love that record. But Spike, for me, has too many great songs to discount - "Let Him Dangle", "Truthful Mirror", "Chewing Gum" and "Baby Plays Around" to name a few...also too many great musicians - M.Ribot, the Dirty Dozen, Allen Toussaint, etc. It most definitely works for me...though I will say the momentum flags a bit in the second half.... | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1013 Registered: 03-2006 |
Kev, I'm not much of a Radiohead disciple(who, for the record, take their name from a song off a disappointing Talking Heads album)...I loved everything up to OK Computer, which I thought was sheer bloody genius, but Kid A and everything that came after left me cold. I have nothing against their taking a more experimental, avant garde tack, it's just that, at the end of the day, those records failed to move me. Mr. Yorke still remains a highly interesting character, though. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1016 Registered: 03-2006 |
ps - Kurt, did you read Bruce Thomas' "The Big Wheel"? It was a supposedly fictional novel that featured thinly disguised events from his time with Elvis and the Attractions, and thinly disguised versions of Elvis and the band. Extremely unflattering to EC, but an entertaining read. I think it had something to do with his getting his ass kicked out of the band for good. | ||
| Michael Bachman Member Username: Michael_bachman Post Number: 294 Registered: 01-2005 |
Rob, I though that "Punch The Clock" that came out in 1983 was a downer and "Blood and Chocolate" and "King of America" that came out in 1986 were comebacks. EC doesn't have a lot of good things to say about "PTC". | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1019 Registered: 03-2006 |
And there's also "Goodbye Cruel World", which EC openly calls his worst album. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 798 Registered: 04-2005 |
Michael, maybe EC doesn't love "Punch the Clock" too much, but it's "Goodbye Cruel World" he has truly disavowed ("congratulations, you've just bought our worst album"). That one was really a stinker--looking back, it probably was one of the most disappointing new albums I can remember buying. How did he go from "Imperial Bedroom" to a pile of crap like "GCW" in two years? And LK has heard this before, but count me as an EC fan who doesn't like "Spike," though I would put "Tramp the Dirt Down" in the pantheon of greatest EC songs. I am one of about three people in the world who prefers "Mighty Like a Rose" to "Spike." Not that I'm saying "Rose" is a great album, mind you... | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 799 Registered: 04-2005 |
Oops, LK beat me to the punch by seven minutes. | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 34 Registered: 08-2006 |
I guess my disappointment with "Spike" was a matter of timing. It's true that GCW is a worse album, but it came out after "Punch the Clock," which I only sort of liked. "Spike" came after two superb records, and, to me, it paled in comparison. I agree with you, LK, that it's got some good songs on it. But the ones I didn't like I really didn't like. Also, it seemed - like a lot of his subsequent work - like he was more concerned with the style of the music than the song. You know, time to play a tin pan alley tune, time to do chamber music, time to trot out the Attractions again. Since "Spike" he's struck me as a bit of a dilettante. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1021 Registered: 03-2006 |
For me, the songs were so good, so powerful, and the new sounds EC was incorporating were so enthralling, I scarcely noticed the "genre-hopping", not that I mind that sort of thing anyway. I am, in fact, drawn to the eclectic. I think, with the multiple musicians employed on Spike, that too, contributed to that effect - opposed to the more uniform one you'd get with a band. The thing to me about genre-hopping anyway, is that, as they say, "it ain't braggin' if you can really do it". I think EC quite ably pulls off all the genres he tackles on the record and I think he's coming from a very sincere place - because he loves them, not because he's trying to show off. Next to Ira Kaplan, he must be one of the biggest musician/fans out there. It's a double-edged sword, isn't it? If he'd continued to record with the Attractions, people would be going, "Ho-hum, another EC and the Attractions album. Why doesn't he branch out a little bit?". | ||
| spence Member Username: Spence Post Number: 877 Registered: 05-2005 |
~On the subject of Elvis Costello. I think the guy was very very good from '81-'85 but whilst the songs I thought were individually really creative and good, they did not work as albums. In many ways it might of been better if the guy subjected us to loads of e.p.'s instead, maybe we would al lnot be so critcal.? | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 414 Registered: 10-2004 |
Every REM album after Green. But then my expectations weren't high to begin with, so maybe disappointment wasn't quite what I was feeling, rather, resigned annoyance. And kind of every REM album after Reckoning. Cocteau Twins - Blue Bell Knoll - I actually think this album is okay now, but at the time I remember being hugely disappointed that their first real full-band, full-length since Treasure was so bland. I remember thinking they'd sold out. Heaven or las Vegas, to me, was infinitely better. They still made concessions to commercialism, but just wrote better songs that time around. Also, Forster's "I had a NY GF" was disappointing to me. I felt it sounded rushed and kind of bland. I remember reading somewhere that Forster, looking back on it, wasn't 100% happy with how it came out. Maybe I should cut it some slack because it's a covers album... I don't know. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1028 Registered: 03-2006 |
Jeff, about the you and me both, about "NY GF"...maybe I enjoyed it when it came out, but man, it really hasn't held up, for me. As a result of seeing it mentioned here and my usual suggestibility, I pulled it out and listened, and was pretty underwhelmed. Still like "Locked Away", though. Robert Christgau, the wiseass, calls it "a covers album that runs out of material". | ||
| Jeff Whiteaker Member Username: Jeff_whiteaker Post Number: 418 Registered: 10-2004 |
That is a wise-ass comment, but it's kind of true, I guess. I don't have that album, I actually returned it to Amoeba the week I got it. That was 11 years ago, and I sort of wonder if I'd feel any differently about it now, though probably not. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 804 Registered: 04-2005 |
You guys sure don't give a guy a compelling reason to buy "NY GF," which I don't own. I purchased a few of the songs from it that interested me (esp. "2541") on iTunes, and I noticed that I was tired of them after two or three listens. RF should stick to doing RF songs, I guess. | ||
| Donat Member Username: Donat Post Number: 201 Registered: 11-2004 |
NYGF aurally is magnificent - the best sounding of all RF's solo work and his albums have always been A1 as far as production goes - no drum machines and sequencers to be heard! RF's choice in covers were straight out of left-field and as an album, it works. If you listen to it as a covers album it's a different experience, as opposed to listening to it like a 70s Scott Walker album [when he didn't have any ink to spill, either]. RF's not the first or the last singer-songwriter to do an album of other people's songs, but it certainly sounds better than Dylan's DYLAN album, right? RF's 'Alone' walks over Heart's version, you've got to admit that. | ||
| Randy Adams Member Username: Randy_adams Post Number: 681 Registered: 03-2005 |
"Look Out, Here Comes Tomorrow" makes NYGF essential. Gotta love Robert's decision not to choose a key he could sing it in. On the subject of Elvis Costello, I think his records and career validate Robert & Grant's wise decision to put only 10 songs on an album. Every Costello record became a blur for me because of the excess of songs which will always include several examples of the same sort of song. Even my giant personal favorite "Get Happy." And he should have made fewer records. And he should have remembered that his clothespin-nose voice flat out will not work on a lot of the genres he personally likes to listen to. Please, no Costello soul and no Costello country. Write the great songs and then find other suitable artists to record them. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 1069 Registered: 05-2005 |
Randy, agree with most of the above 100%, but have to disagree on "Costello country". I love when he does country, for me the only disappointing thing about Almost Blue is the choice of songs, playing and singing are top notch. nice to have you back btw. | ||
| Donat Member Username: Donat Post Number: 205 Registered: 11-2004 |
Costello just got zinged! Randy's right, though - he likes too many genres (who can blame him?) but tries to record in all of them, leaving some of his audience confused and himself most likely! I'm not big on David Byrne's forays into 'world music' while we're pulling down our musical heroes by a few notches. | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1042 Registered: 03-2006 |
Actually, I loves me some Elvis Country (wasn't that actually the title of a Presley comp? If not, it should've been) - Almost Blue is, to me, very wonderful - but also love some of his soul sorties, like "Getting Mighty Crowded", "I Can't Stand Up For Falling Down", "Find Yourself Another Fool", and "Pouring Water On a Drowning Man" to name a few... I do think Randy has a point, though, about the whole, as the Dude (the small Lebowski) calls it, "brevity thing". The GoBees understood that basic tenet of showbiz, "always leave 'em wanting more". | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 43 Registered: 08-2006 |
Randy: I think you're on to something about "digital bloat." Costello's a prime example, but so are Springsteen and Richard Thompson, to name a couple. The last Springsteen record I'd consider great was "Tunnel of Love," with 12 songs; the last RT was "Amnesia," with 10. Springsteen's "The Rising," for example, is the kernal of a good record obscured by padding. I've always admired the GBs 10-song practice, and the fact that so many great songs ended up as B-sides or unreleased. Too many bands, it seems, pollute what could be good albums with barrel scrapings. 45-50 minutes used to be considered long for an album. Now it's hardly the halfway mark on a lot of new CDs. | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 814 Registered: 04-2005 |
I'm with you guys. 10 or 12 songs in 40 minutes is about right. I don't feel as if I'm getting "value" on something like, say, the latest Yo La Tengo album that has at least 20 minutes of stuff I usually won't want to listen to. The Go-Betweens and their strict adherence to the "old school" 10-song album format is one of their great charms. Even the weaker albums fly by--and that's how albums should be, not the grueling endurance tests we usually get in the CD era. | ||
| Rob Brookman Member Username: Rob_b Post Number: 45 Registered: 08-2006 |
I don't know if it's down to the artists or the labels, but it does seem that someone in the recording industry ivory tower feels that length = "value." My stepbrother is a talented musician who was signed to a well-known indie label a few years back, and he submitted an album to them that contained nine songs. It was terrific as was, brief but very high quality. But the label came back to him and said, "one more." He managed to produce a good tune to fill the slot, but it was instructive of the mentality. All I can figure is that labels feel like a buck a song is about right, "value"-wise, hence the 14-15 song norm we're saddled with. | ||
| jerry hann Member Username: Jerry_h Post Number: 292 Registered: 07-2005 |
Good discussion guys,I'm a big costello and Springsteen fan an yes there are a few songs onexh of their albums which should have been left off,going back to Tunnel of Love for Springsteen and well Blood and Chocolates of EC, even KOA could have left out the odd track. Now I think every band has to fill the CD to give value for money or to satisfy there egos. Often less is more think the Smiths/Go-Betweens. Yo La Tengo I'm new to.And do struggle with the longer tracks and that is putting me off them-should I persist? | ||
| andreas Member Username: Andreas Post Number: 282 Registered: 04-2006 |
through my record buying career i made the experience that the ep- format is the one i prefer. 5 to 7 songs, half an hour of good music. since they use the whole space of cd's you get more music for your money, but more value? for sure, this isn't valid for all ep's / cd's. | ||
| kevin Member Username: Kevin Post Number: 1070 Registered: 05-2005 |
persist jerry, persist | ||
| Little Keith Member Username: Manosludge Post Number: 1048 Registered: 03-2006 |
Sometimes even 10 songs seems too long...anybody remember LPs? Those round black things with the holes in the middle? All you listened to back then was a side at a time. You'd stack them up on your changer and listen to a bunch of sides of different albums...getting up from making out with your girlfriend or smoking a joint to flip a record over was unthinkable... | ||
| Kurt Stephan Member Username: Slothbert Post Number: 816 Registered: 04-2005 |
I do miss thinking of albums in terms of sides. Sometimes four or five songs in a row by an artist are all you need. I suppose iPod playlists are the modern day equivalent of stacking singles or LP sides on a changer. |