| Author | Message | ||
     rj |
so to open -when people are dead who was the mysterious Irish women who co-wrote?? this song. Also is she the subject of the house jack kerouac built -"your reading me poetry thats Irish and so black" Any one have any info on who this mysterious lady was?? | ||
| david nichols |
From the distant depths of my memory, being told about it during the book research, she was a fan who used to come and see them a lot (in the UK) and sent or gave them a lot of poetry. I think she was quite young. Anyone got the time for an internet search? (I'm always amazed by how many people AREN'T on the internet. As far as the internet's concerned, for instance, my sister does not exist. Amazing.) | ||
| John |
From my memory of the notes to the 1978-1990 compilation, Robert describes her as "Irish poet Marion Stout". Beyond that, I know nothing. | ||
| Tony |
I just googled -Marion Stout and there was nothing out there in cyberspace , according to the great search engine in the sky :-). | ||
| ƒredrik |
Well, search again. I found her. Or at least mentioned on http://www.sff.net/people/chris.amies/acnestis/nov2001.htm I couldn't be arsed to read the whole article, but someone obviously claim to know her here. "That's so Marion". http://www.tangents.co.uk/tangents/main/pre-2001/gobetweens.html Where they mention she died three years after the song was written. ƒ | ||
| Cichli Suite |
Marion Stout could be a pseudonym, or a Robert Forster invention like 'Rachel Worth'. ...Or to be more creative... Stout isn't a common surname in Ireland. There are very few 'Stout's listed in the phone book. It is, however, the beverage of choice on these shores, and it is definitely "Irish and so black" as Robert refers to the poetry read to him by Marion in the song 'the House that Jack Kerouac built"'. Perhaps Marion Stout is a metaphor for alcohol, or the affect it can have on creativity/life in general. The Refrain for 'Jack Kerouac' is "Keep me away from her", a natural response to alcohol's darker sider, particularly if we consider the madness and reclusiveness into which Jack Kerouac slipped at the end of his life. Perhaps the "House that Jack Kerouac built" is about the seductive myth of creativity fueled by drink and drugs. "Oh no, what am I doing here, in the house Jack Kerouac built. There's white magic, and bad rock'n'roll, Your friend there says, he's the gatekeeper to my soul." That's me done. Cichli | ||
| Mark |
Oh, that reminds me; can the Internet make sister 'in-laws' disappear as well? ...no!?? (damn) | ||
| James |
The article refers to someone called Scott who died three years later, not Marion Stout. | ||
| ƒredrik |
Oh! (Blushing like if I was clusterbombed with red ink ) I am such a lame reader. My apologies ƒ | ||
| chris |
I don't know if her name was originally Marion Stout but that's what she called herself when I knew her. (I wrote the article fredrik found). Marion used to go to poetry gigs in London in the late 1980s including 'Wooden Lambs'. I haven't seen her nor heard of her for years now; still have some photographs of her though which I could post if that would count as evidence. | ||
| Mark Ilsley |
Thanks Chris, for taking the trouble to come here. Send a message to admin (Jon) to arrange an upload or if that can't be arranged consider publishing it at PictureTrail.com (or simular) and posting a link here. | ||
| chris |
The pictures are now at http://www.sff.net/people/chris.amies/pictures/marion/index.htm | ||
| Marian Stout |
I am definetly not dead, and don`t recall Chris, I dislike having my photographs taken, but hey maybe I didn`t remember?? As for my being a methapor for alcohol???? I was never a fan of the Go-betweens and had never even heard of them before I met Robert Foster and he asked me out! Since then my admiration for them has grown and I go to gigs and buy cds like every one else. Mystery solved! By the way I am now an established novelist and do not write under my real name(I value my privacy too much) Sincerely, Marian Stout | ||
| jerry |
Good to have you back with the living, Marion. | ||
| Anonymous |
Thanks just returned from Turkey. Glad to be alive. Marian | ||
| jerry |
Mark, I've just noticed your post on this thread and was wondering, do you do mother in law jokes? | ||
| Randy Adams |
I love Cichli's idea of "House That Jack Kerouac Built" being about overpowering by drink, very creative. Personally, I think booze/drugs actually DO enhance creativity for a limited period of time by re-mapping the memory access in your head. However, once the initial rush of this is over . . . . | ||
| Cichli Suite |
The whole thing was hanging together so well until the real Marion Stout showed up and objected to being used as a metaphor for alcohol abuse. Quite right too! Great name, Marion Stout. It's like the name of a drink you might imbibe on a religious holiday like Good Friday, for instance. Though, that would be 'Marian Stout', I guess. Randy, I think what I was getting at was that writers of the 'beat generation' (Kerouac, Borroughs,..) describe an underworld of alcohol and drug abuse that seemed authentic, free-spirited (compared to the sanitised life paths on offer) and at the same time romantic to many people ( I think Tom Waits taps in to the same vibe). Yet, Kerrouac's world (the house he built, if you like) is very much a fictional device, however much he draws upon his real experiences. The problems occur when people mistake this world for 'real' life, and try to live it. I've generally felt that Robert is singing about getting suckered by a myth when he sings "Oh no, what am I doing here, in the house Jack Kerouac built. There's white magic, and bad rock'n'roll, Your friend there says, he's the gatekeeper to my soul." But then again, like many a great Go-between song, it could just be about a girl.... | ||
| Randy Adams |
I confess I always assumed that it was about a girl. I thought your alternative reading was really interesting. It reminded me of a largely forgotten wonderful old Neil Young classic, "The Old Laughing Lady." | ||
| Cichli Suite |
Oh, yes I know "The old laughing lady" - great song. I see the connection: 'See the drunkard of the village falling on the street. Can't tell his ankles from the rest of his feet. He loves his old laughing lady 'cause her taste is so sweet. But his laughing lady's loving ain't the kind he can keep.' I recall Neil Young has written several songs about the detrimental affects of substance abuse. I know that one, if not two, members of Crazy Horse fell fatally for the charms of the Old Laughing Lady and her kin. Cichli | ||
| Fred Tadrowski Member Username: Ftadrowski Post Number: 25 Registered: 03-2015 |
"When People Are Dead" has always been one of my favorite Go-Betweens songs and like others see a connection with "The House That Jack Kerouac Built". I maybe way off the mark but could bestselling Irish author Marian Keyes be Marion Stout? Notice how the real Marian Stout spells her first name in this thread. According to her bio, she moved to London as a young women in February 1986 and lived in a Hackney squat. She got a admin. job, later developed a drinking problem, and attempted suicide in London. I have found no reference of her writing poetry; but she started writing short stories in London, which led to her career as a novelist. I did find a reference of her reading the poetry of Raymond Carver and Charles Bukowski during this dark period. Maybe there will be something in the memoir about Marion Stout? | ||
| KLorraine Unregistered guest |
Marian Stout did not squat in hackney in 1986. Initially, she lived in London close to her brother and sister. She was into creative writing etc. I was very close to her, and her family. As far as I remember she was living near baker Street at the time. She told me all about it.i spoke with her brother a few months back she seems ok.... | ||
| lorraine Unregistered guest |
Marian Keyes is NOT Marian Stout. |